The not really out, crossdresser

A 'round table' for CDs, TGs and GG/SOs to talk with each other. We're all in this together, so let's make the most of it.

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Anita
Miss Diamond Goddess
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Location: Burlingame, CA (San Francisco Bay area)

Post by Anita »

Hi All-
I am forcing myself to limit time on the Internet, and threads such as this one are very hard to do justice to on limited time.

Elizabeth, I've replied to other posts of yours that transgender limbo is a hard land to live in. To some extent I am in the transsexual closet. What I find, though, is that I can't force a desire for fulltime living.

It is hard on me, because I try to project out five years, and I'm stumped. :( I have to live day-to-day with this, and then I'm fine.

I know I will always need some part of my life to be lived as a woman. Right now, the time I spend dressed and out in public is enough.

But there are big warning signs out there. I went to my 30th class reunion in a nice suit, and had a good time. I see my 40th coming up in three years, and already I can see that a suit is now "male drag" for me, and not very satisfying. I am much more likely to want to go as a woman, and that gets very sticky in a hurry. I can just not go at all, and that may be my choice. But that's just an example of how my fence-sitting in not a comfortable place to be.

My transsexual friends do ask leading questions from time to time. It's like a radar they send out. And while I identify more as a woman than I do as a man, I am not motivated enough to throw my whole world upside-down to do it. And there are still advantages to living in both worlds.

That's an interesting analogy, about left-handedness. I'm a lefty, so I know the territory well. That comparison does give some of the flavor of what it feels like to "know" something about one's inner world. But the analogy breaks down quickly, because when it comes to left-handedness, the inner world can be demonstrated in the outer world, for all to see.

When my left-handed mother was a girl of 3, in 1910, her family made great efforts to "change" her into a righty. (Why they thought they could, I don't know--was it a popular theory at the turn of that century?) Of course it didn't work, and her writing would have been horrible if they had insisted on continuing.

Gender feeling can be equally strong, and there is no way for a youngster to prove it. So the young transgender guy or gal gets stuffed into the behavior that matches their body.

Even the most well-meaning parents would have a hard time believing that their 4 year old knows that the gender isn't matching the body. Adults think that since a child doesn't understand sexuality, then they also can't understand gender. But the two are different, and children do seem to know gender. I knew the differences very clearly at 4, and felt sad watching "Cinderella," because I already knew that I could never wear a gown like that, or dance as a woman on a ballroom floor. It took forty-five years for me to show that four-year old self that it wasn't set in stone the way he thought it was. :mrgreen:
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Jeannie
Miss Ruby Goddess
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Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2005 7:19 pm
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I know how you feel Anita.

Post by Jeannie »

I'm stuck in purgatory also. Personally I hate dressing like a guy. I always dress as a woman at home because all my friends know what to expect if they come over. My kids and all their friends know and I'm so lucky. My printing shop is on the first floor and in the morning I put on jeans and t shirt and workboots. I'm still trying to find workboots with 3 inch heels. Usually secretary mode in the afternoon!
As for limiting yourself Anita. Haven't we limited ourselves our whole lives? I got tired of it. I have one story for you Hon.
My Father, Louie, who I worked with for the last forty years died two days before New Years 2004. He was over for Christmas dinner a week earlier and had his glass of wine with his Linguini and anchovies. He said to me "I think I'm going to limit myself to only 3 glasses of wine per week." I said "Pop. You're 91 and enjoy your glass of wine with your meals. Why would you want to limit what you really enjoy at your age?" He thought about it and said "Give me another glass of wine." He had two more Anita! Great! I'm such a bad egg. I got my 91 year old Father bombed on Christmas! A week later I picked him up at his house, took him to breakfast as usual and we worked in our shop all morning. My sister made him his favorite lunch of broccoli rabe and sausage and he went swimming at The Boys Club across the street as he has done for the last 18 years, five days a week and he died swimming in the pool. We should all be so lucky Anita. I'm glad I got him bombed on Christmas. It was our farewell party but I didn't know it. Neither did he. I miss him. He was a great man and always good to me. Life goes on Hon. Don't limit yourself. Be happy with what makes you feel whole and a better person. Like the line from Tom Cruise in Risky Business, "Every so often in life you just have to say... What the F---!" I'm there Hon! It feels fabulous!Sweet! Hugs

Love
Jeannie

PS. I always loved the tone that Duane Allman got with his guitar and amps. I also loved Leslie West's sound. My all time favorite is Eric Clapton's sound on the live version of "Sittting on Top Of the World" from Goodbye Cream. Nasty as could be! Oh Yeah. I just heard one of my favorites "Rocky Mountain Way" with Joe"freakin'" Walsh. Love that slide sound! Sweet! :)
Marlena Dahlstrom
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Location: SF Bay Area

Post by Marlena Dahlstrom »

CJ, one thing that I've found helpful is to break "gender dysphoria" in to more specific components:

- sex identity -- i.e. whether you want to see someone male or female when you look in the mirror and how comfortable you are with the body you're in.

- gender self-identity -- i.e. whether you see yourself as "masculine" or "feminine" in all your non-physical aspects

- gender social identity -- i.e. your gendered interactions with others and the gendered social roles you partake in

Admittedly, the latter two are intertwined -- if you don't feel entirely "masculine" (or "feminine") you're probably not going to feel comfortable playing the "masculine" (or "feminine") role in society. Conversely, if you don't feel comfortable playing the "masculine" (or "feminine") role in society, that may cause you to feel like your gender self-identity differs.

Some folks feel strongly disphoric across all three dimensions, some on only one, some in varying degrees on different ones.

I know one transitioned TS who did so primarily because she felt she was in the wrong body -- she herself says she could have "been herself" personality-wise as man and moved in circles where that would've have been a problem.

I know other TSs who felt the need to live as women but who eventually got GRS not out of any dislike for their genitals, but because having an "appropriate" body helped them lived that life. Conversely, I know others who cross-live, but don't feel a need to make body mods. TS? transgenderist? Male-born woman? I'll let them define themselves.

I think many crossdressers are more focused on the social aspects of gender. Some may also feel they've got personalities that don't fit neatly into the "masculine" box. Some if society were different might prefer to live as "feminine men," some would alternate the gender they present. Others are happy to just be "gender spring breakers."

As far as TS "peer pressure," yes unfortunately. It does exist. For example, I was at a TG dinner once and the first thing the TS next to me said was that she knew a good surgeon when I was ready. This from someone who was just meeting me for the first time....

As has been said, it usually seems like someone's trying to validate their own experience. In this case, after a fairly heated argument, it turned out the TS in question felt she'd transitioned years later than she should've and now it was her "mission" to help others transition earlier. Of course, the possibility that her experience might not be others' experiences eluded her. She just couldn't grasp that I had given the issue some thought and that I was happy where I was, and happy being a man -- since after all she was never happy as a man. And months later she fessed up that she's a big believer in the gender binary, can't understand why someone might want to straddled it and that crossdressers freak her out. (Someone once jokingly said TSs are just CDs who can't handle ambiguity and I do think there's a bit of truth in that with some TSs.)

An extreme case, admittedly. What I find more common is the unthinking assumptions and/or cheerleading. Because I present well en femme, I've had people asking when I was starting hormones, etc. Or you'll see things in discussions like "we've all have doubts at X, but life was so much better once I did Y."

And of course there's the pernicious tranny hierarchy... Where TSs are more "real" than TGs, who are more "real" than the public CDs, who are more "real" than the closeted CDs, who are more "real" than pantyhose fetishes. And of course, post-op TSs are more "real" than pre-ops, who are more "real" than non-ops. So I think some of that plays into the TS peer pressure that goes on.

When the important thing is finding a place -- where ever that is -- where you're comfortable.

What's infuriating from this CD's perspective is that I feel like we're often in a Catch-22: The more I or others say we're happy where we are, the more evidence that is to those "who know better" that we're in denial.

As Helen Boyd once aptly put it: it's
"the sound of the other shoe not dropping." That is, unless you transition, you have no way to "mark" that you're at the end of your road. And since so many transsexuals say "you can't know if you're in denial" then there is no "end of road" for people who aren't transsexual, or who don't transition even if they are.
And it's this sort of second-guessing that's infuriating. It's one thing to hear it from the muggles who don't know any better, but it's another to hear it from people who are familiar with trans issues.

Anyway, the upshot of all of this, is I think it behooves of us to realize we're in delicate terrority and we need to be very careful to avoid generalizating, or projecting our experiences for others. For example, I got really angry with a TS who said in some many words that "you'll never know that you aren't." In reality what she really meant was: "It's hard for some people, including myself, to know, to really know, that they were repressing their need to transition until they got to a point where they felt they had no other alternative." And if she'd phrased it that way, I wouldn't have had a problem with it.

Incidentally, there's also the issue of an aquaintance of mine, Andrea, calls "dragging the frame of reference." It's something that occurs in organization -- those who have the most time and energy end up setting the agenda. It's not an evil thing, it's just human nature. But what happens in "transgender" organizations is that it's usually TSs who end up running them for a variety of reasons (it's more important when you're 24/7, they're out of the closet, etc.) But the upshot is that CDs can feel like these organizations don't serve them, which can become a vicious circle. For example, when Andrea went to join one group, they couldn't understand why having a changing room might be important.

There's a similar dynamic that's going on with language -- with "transgender" becoming a synonym for "transsexual" (apparently it's being favored by TSs who don't like the fact that there's "sex" in "transsexual"). Ordinarily, I'd encourage people to define themselves the way that they want to. The problem is that since "transgender" was adopted as an umbrella term to cover the entire trans spectrum, redefining it as "TS" effectively defines the rest of us out of existence -- at least, as commonly happens, TSs who identify themselves as TG don't mention there are other types of TG folks as well. It's sort of like if TSs started being referred to as "full-time CDs" -- I imagine most of them wouldn't be happy with that, since that term doesn't convey what they see as their identity.

BTW, I'm a lefty as well, so as has been said, I can definitely understand the "I just am" feeling.
Lena

A dream? What is a dream, but a blueprint for courageous action.
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CJ
Miss Diamond Goddess
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Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2003 11:12 pm
Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada

Post by CJ »

Thanks for the post, Marlena. Like Anita's and Elizabeth's, your clear-headed and lucid writing always gives me much food for thought.

Love,
CJ
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