Femininity Overconsumers

[CJ]

Hi all,

Not really sure where I'm going with all this. I'm basically in a "thinking out loud" kind of mood, but here goes.

We live in a consumer society. It's one of the defining features of our economic system. We buy. We are encouraged to buy. We are encouraged to buy not only goods and services but also to buy "into" ideas, beliefs, opinions, worldviews, and the like. Freedom, for instance. Freedom sells. Happiness as a goal sells. Rugged individualism sells. Violence sells.

Femininity sells. "Woman" as an idea--the very idea of femininity--is a consumer "product." We see it on television, in the film industry, in the fashion magazines, in the shopping malls, in the cosmetics industry (the main purveyors of femininity as a product); in fact, we see it everywhere.

Of course, masculinity sells, too, but I won't concern myself with that right now.

Okay, now to take this one step further. It's not the consumption of goods, services, and ideas that define our society but, rather, the overconsumption of these things. We gobble up too much of everything; from credit-card-thin computers to pet therapy to the marketplace of religious beliefs, we have a surfeit of goods, services, and ideas. And we're eating it all up as much, and as fast, as we can.

My point? Femininity is no exception to this. Dangle femininity in front of our eyes as a desirable consumable, and it stands to reason that we will crave it. Usually, men consume femininity with, and through, the infamous "male gaze" feminists so often rant about. Men consume images and visions of femininity (and it could be that there is some evolutionary psychology principle at work here). This gives rise, for example, to the pornography industry. Women, on the other hand, tend to consume embodiments of femininity. Age- and death-defying lotions, plastic surgery, the cult of the perfect female shape, etc., etc.

My real point is this, that the transgendered men that we are are really overconsumers of femininity. We aren't satisfied with images of Woman; we seek also the embodiment of Woman. It's not enough for us to gaze upon femininity as a desirable consumable, we need to embody that femininity as well, to express it in our own flesh.

Transvestite fiction is a case in point. In the images and drawings that often accompany these texts--and, remember, these little tomes are written by men, for men--we see protagonists (male) and antagonists (female) that are both portrayed as dripping with an excessive, over-the-top, up-to-the-hilt femininity. Big breasts and buttocks (on both males and females), long legs, thin calves, dainty feet and hands, tons of makeup, luxurious hair, and extremely sexy and erotic women's lingerie or clothing (all this, again, on both males and females). In other words, femininity to the nth degree.

This is an example of the male gaze (re: the image of femininity) commingled with the idealized bodily self (re: the embodiment of femininity). The best of both worlds: we see Woman and we are--or, usually, are forced to be--Woman. (The "forced" part is simply an acknowledgment that, in this culture, it's not permitted for a man to willingly embrace the embodiment of femininity.) Another example is the marked status of mirrors in the lives of CDs. Here again we get the image and the embodiment all rolled up into one.

Thus, where non-transgendered men will tend to be consumers of femininity, could it be that the transgendered men that we are are simply overconsumers of femininity? that we want femininity to be situated in our bodies as well as in the object of our gaze?

This goes even further. The basic difficulty with living in a society that overconsumes is that our needs and desires will rarely be met and satisfied with what we have or, more to the point, with what we can have. We'll always need or desire more than what we've got and more than what we can get. The ad industry, for instance, knows this and is hard at work in making sure that we can never feel fulfilled. Now if, as I say, femininity is one such desirable consumable, it stands to reason that, for some of us, too much is too little. Two cases in point: women who are addicted to plastic surgery and men who go to extreme lengths to embody femininity.

I know a transsexual woman (i.e., MtF) who's perennially despondent over the fact that her femininity always seems lacking somehow. She can never be satisfied with how she "turned out." There's endless tweaking and perfectibility to tend to. I think this is because she's so desperately trying to embody "Woman" rather than a woman. She's caught in the femininity overconsumption trap.

This kind of trap sheds a whole different light on the notion of "passing." I mean, passing for what? For a woman? Or for "Woman." If the former, then all women and many men can do this; if the latter, then very few women and even fewer men can do this.

I've come to think about all this after reading several posts here, including one by an SO who was wondering what our end goal was when we CDs first tried to present as women.

Just had to put that out there. Again, thinking out loud here. Any comments?

Love,
CJ

[DonnaT]

I think a lot of us do over consume. I know I have things I've only worn once. A closet full of things. A storage rack full of heels. Lingerie taking up more than one drawer.

Do we consume more than women with respect to womanly things? Some do, some don't. So basically, many of us aren't that much different than many women in this regard. We see something we like, we buy it if we can.

If everyone just bought the basics the worlds economy would be quite different.

In fact, civilization wouldn't be as advanced as it is. We want, and what we want need to be better than what's available. But we have limits, and want better things at cheaper prices. Which is why much of what we buy comes from overseas.

Do we who are transgendered over consume more than those who aren't?

Probably not. It's only different with regard to the products bought.

[Absaroka]

An excellent post CJ. I'd say there are probably several threads going on at once in the post.

First, feminimity and consumerism. As a father of teenage girls I'd say that as strongly voiced as you are, you are still understating the case. I'd say that this is one of the many areas where advertising, and not just advertising per se but the whole marketing "conspiracy" (not that people are sitting in rooms plotting although they probably are) has created a huge need where none need exist for women to be "feminine" The most distorted expression I've ever heard of this is from a good friend who once said she thought of pregnancy as unfeminine. It was after all neither slim nor delicate.

But for those of us who are fathers, consider this. Remember what your wifes vagina looked like as the baby slid out. That is what feminimity really is.

On to us. Yes I think your description of us as over consumers is in some cases accurate. Also ther is such a gray area between us as consumers of feminimity and consumers of sex. Of wearing the clothes as a way of being inside the woman, not just physically but at another level.

I've said this many times here. But our conception of feminimity so often seems to be about being pretty. Which means it has to do with sex. As Diedre McClosky and Helen Boyd have both said, if a man really wants to get in touch with his inner woman, all he has to do is wash the dishes. But we don't post about that much. Yes some of post a lot about being in touch with our inner woman allowing us to be more empathic. But those posts are vastly outnumbered by us bemoaning the fact that our wives don't like our dressing. Well wake up. Dressing to please your spouse is what women do. Dressing the way they want is what men do. Putting on a dress and wanting our wife to accept it is male privilege and not at all feminine.

But I seem to have digressed.

Zari

[Virginia]

Does not CJ make us think? Thanks, hon!!!!

How fine a line is there between "over-consumption" and obsession?? I will admit to being guilty of both and a definite failure at obsession.

I cannot financially afford the over-consumption of the things I would like from clothing to make-up. I mean, I would love to have a dresser full of Sephora make-up and as for clothes, well that goes without saying. $1500 slingback 4" heels, $250 bras, skirts, dresses, Coach hand bags?! Yes, over-consumption when you buy it and can't really afford it!

Obsession? Guilty as charged! When I get dressed to go out, perfection is the goal, not to pass, but Virginia wants to look------ well pick a word or two, awesome, beautiful, fantastic, drop-dead-gorgeous.

Forget "passable," she is a lady going out and wants to look as nice as she can. Obsession, yes, has she done it?? NO! Every time she looks in the mirror she sees a short-coming here or a flaw there or the colors just don't quite make it, or in number of other minor details that just don't live up to her desire. Does not stop her, as she corrects what minor imperfections she can, grabs her purse and "Here stands Virginia, what do you think?!"

Actually as for the magazines, Vogue, Bazaar to name a couple, those model are either computer generated "stick figures" or so anemic that I don't understand how they can motivate under their own power with no muscles, just skeletal constructs with big lips!

One other point about over-consumption, I did not want to bring this up, but I can't help myself. On the last few trips to the supermarket, I have had occasion to notice several folks having to use food stamps and that is fine, but when I look at them and look as what they are buying. 250 -300 pounds and a grocery cart full of "empty calories." Over-consumption of "junk food" and under-consumption of ego and education.

Thanks for being there for us, CJ

Love ya,

Virginia

[Bernice]

I love that CJ always makes us think. But tonight I'm too tired to contribute on her level.

But Virginia, look at my Avatar. I'm one of those newly 300+ pound monsters. I never set out to be fat, and in fact I did what I thought I could to arrive there as slowly as possible, but here I am.

Also, without a job since last May, I'm pinching pennies harder than ever. So yes, I forgo the Fillet Mignon which would be much healthier for me, and instead go for the 99 cent sausage. Forgo the exorbitantly expensive fresh veggies and fruit, and go for rice, potatoes, noodles, and chocolate. I actually eat canned Ravioli that should have been banned for humans long ago. Last night I enjoyed a double cheeseburger, and had an open bag of kettle chips (potato crisps), and you guessed it - I ate way too much. My point is that you know I'm not poorly educated, and I know my condition is not healthy, but that obesity is way more complicated than you made it sound.

Not to belabor the point, but I just read the other day that there are some 48 viruses that are known to cause long term obesity in humans!

No, I'm not really rationalizing. I have to take responsibility for my condition. Still, I can't see spending my life savings to go to a fat farm for the year it would take. Gastric lap-band surgery seems awfully extreme.

The average American is now way over the 170 pound limit set by the FAA. A third of us are now morbidly obese. We can't all be lazy, stupid, and gluttonous. Part of it is the availability of inexpensive unhealthy food. But, it is way more complicated than that, kind of like crossdressing or transgenderism. If it were as simple as you make it out to be, we'd all be healthy and trim, pressing 600 pounds with one arm.

Hugs,

Bernice

[Absaroka]

There is a reason why America is known in some parts of the world as the place where the rich are thin and the poor are fat.


VIrginia in reference to your comment that there is always a flaw somewhere, I prefer the idea of " perfect in our imperfection"


Zari

[Robyn Katie]

CJ, you are working a deep vein there. Our culture of greed makes us all (even if we consciously try to do otherwise) want to have more than we have, presumably so we can be more than we are. We cram, we grab, we scarcely take time to react to what we have acquired.

My wardrobe, which is 98% femme, certainly reflects this. I have more blouses than I need, more skirts, more panties, more this, more that ...

I'm in haste and can't answer properly, but one point does keep occurring to me. Concerning your remarks about femininity being a consumable for GGs as well as us —

The fundamental problem for each woman, in a world full of differentially randy men, is that she can't be Everywoman, except in the early stages of a relationship. Eventually she is only one woman. Men, however, seem constitutionally set up to ogle or imaginatively possess a diversity of women ... symbolized, perhaps, by the Playmate of the Month. That's Mother Nature talking, of course, setting us up to sow our seed wide and far, but (sorry if this sounds chilly) each woman is only one plot of ground, and there is a whole planet of fields. Over the centuries the stories have multiplied: men (women too of course) not being able to stay faithful ... grass greener on the far side, etc.

So the Femininity Industry is busy selling women the means to become Everywoman, attract and keep a man (or woman, yes), by constructing a false diversity of surface. Pays billions! Doesn't work terribly well in the long run, but in the short run it's pretty effective.

As for us CD/TG and even TS people, I think you're right that we do overconsume. We have a need to possess femininity to the Nth degree. We have perhaps overshot the mark, but it seems we need to go past coupling into a kind of incestuous compound self that internalizes the femininity we crave, and also covers our surface with it. So now this wonder of femaleness that's always mesmerized us becomes literally part of us — not just a partner in the house, but an aggregate self.

As for end goal ... and never being satisfied with "how we turned out" ... that's the primary point of advertising (you aren't good enough, but you will be if you just buy X) ... but it also goes with the CD/TG and even TS territory. By definition we can never quite be the women we'd wish to be—even if we hire coaches, do makeovers — even have gender reassignment surgery and seem to the world entirely female, still ... no soap. We're never *quite* there.

We set ourselves up for failure and dissatisfaction on this quaky ground. Meanwhile a busy acquisitive society based entirely on the ethics of profit is happily doing the same for us and everyone, and raking in the bucks on our folly.

Not surprising, then, in this milieu, and with our exaggerated hopes and expectations for ourselves, if it's extremely difficult to be content with being the person we are!

Do pardon my haste today; I hope somehow you can make sense of all this though it's off the top of my addled head.

Love, Robyn Katie

[Absaroka]

Great post Robyn. There's a lot of food for thought in it, as in the whole thread.

I got to thinking about the post about being fat. I guess it's a change of topic but I'll put it here since it's also about consumerism.

A while ago I decided to make a very serious effort to lose weight, and succeeded. I had to go through a bunch of emotional stuff which I'll ignore here, and cut to the food chase.

I decided the easiest way to lose weight would be to eat when I was putting myself through college and had very little money. It's a pretty healthy eating plan.

Bfast is oatmeal. Relatively good for you and costs very little.

Lunch is often a peanut butter and jelly sandwich, or I'll splurge on plain store brand yogurt and through some roasted buckwheat and nuts in it. Or the non fat storebrand cottage cheese. Along with that I'll have a couple pieces of whatever fruit's in season. Bananas are a cheap source of calories and I eat a lot of them. Otherwise berries in the summer, citrus in the winter, apples in the fall. Whatever is cheapest at the store is usually what's in season. You can feed yourself for a long time with one watermelon.

Vegies aren't that expensive. A couple of carrots, a cucumber, a head of lettuce, a handful of radishes. All right out of the bag, no preparation except peeling and washing.

Dinner usually features rice, which is very inexpensive, and some beans, usually canned since I fart enough already without the dried beans which cost less. I; sautee an onion and some frozen vegies, usually turnips and kale or collards or turnip greens. Throw a little soy sauce or barbecue sauce on them. Mushrooms are a nice special treat.

For an occaisonal treat I'll have whatever canned fish is cheapest, usually mackerel, which is one of my favorites anyway. If steak of chicken is on sale I'll buy some and cut it into servings and freeze most of it. The rest of my family is vegetarian anyway. I eat a lot more meat and fish now than I did then, since I now have money to buy it with. Plus I now have a friend who gives me a lot of her wild food.

As you can see, the food is simple. It doesn't cost as much as a diet of big macs and donuts, and rice costs less than mac and cheese. It's pretty inexpensive, and doesn't take much preparation. What it is not is impressive. SImple food that tastes good if you are hungry.

When I got younger I got good at spicing it up enough to be able to invite folks for dinner. A little tomato sauce goes a long way, and a little cutting turns the raw vegies into salad. It took a year for my wife to begin questioning my cooking, and that was only because I served her pigs ears one night. I hadn't realized she was vegetarian, since it was all I ate most of the time the subject didn't come up. I did have another female friend who delighted in pig tails, corn bread, and collard greens. The landlord got upset about the pile of tailbones outside the kitchen window. But that's another story.

Point is, if we get rid of the consumerism and let food just be food, healthy nutrition is possible. Although I really do like having a little extra money to splurge on steak and sushi sometimes. (Yes SL I remember your comment that salad is what food eats. Think of it as sometimes I eliminate the middle man or middle cow, or whatever)

Zari

[CJ]

Hi all,

A most excellent post, Robyn. Thanks for the contribution. And, really, if this is you being hasty, then I wouldn't want to have to reckon with your discursive prowess when you take your time in focusing on a subject. But, then, I knew that already!

Robyn, you wrote that it seems we need to go past coupling into a kind of incestuous compound self that internalizes the femininity we crave, and also covers our surface with it.

I agree. If I understand you, you conclude by saying that femininity internalized (via the deep and, as you say, "incestuous," dynamics that lead to the rise--or to the creation--of a compound self) cannot be dissociated from femininity externalized. That the femininity that needs and wants to be recognized within--at this point, regardless of its origin--simultaneously needs and wants to see itself mirrored without. Seems to me, if this is the case, that it follows that an unbearable cognitive dissonance will result if "the woman within" cannot find a way to also be "the woman without." They are, after all, one and the same "woman." And, oh surprise! that dissonance holds true for many, if not most, of us. And that dissonance is, in fact, so unbearable that many transgendered folks are willing to go to great lengths to escape it, from drowning in addictions, to subjecting their bodies to extreme forms of modification, through to preferring non-existence to existence.

It's a wonder to me that so many of us here are still even quasi-functional, at worst. This road is not golden, however much we may wish to sugar-coat it.

But this is a digression.

Or is it?

I'm tired and need to get some shuteye. I'll think on this some more.

But thanks to everyone who responded here (although I'll admit I have not much to say about the issue of hamburgers vs. salads).

Love,
CJ

[Robyn Katie]

Hi CJ,

I agree. Cognitive dissonance between the inner and outer is the disease of our society. Of a leisure society, of course — if we were on the firing line of war, poverty, disaster, etc., none of this would matter. (For example, I doubt many dispossessed Haitians are pondering their gender issues at the moment.) But since we're leisured, and exploratory, it looms large.

I wonder if CD/TS/TG people tend to mirror the existential problems of society at large, but magnified. Most people have moments where gender, personality, libido, all sorts of aspects of themselves, turn distorted and conflicting; our pushing the limits makes all those contrasts more drastic.

Zari, your food observations are timely, since my wife and I have been trying to get out of the Monsanto-dominated processed food chain altogether. Simple food. Whole food that, to the extent possible, hasn't been mixed with corn syrup, soy (a horrendous fake food unless fermented), preservatives, and assorted junk the food industry is trying to get rid of. I probably sound like a food faddist, but seeing videos like "Food, Inc." has been a real wake-up call for us.

Clealry it's not possible, or desirable, to unhook from consumerism altogether, but we're at least paying lots more attention and trying to eat healthier and cut out processed foods as much as we can.

So hooray for your diet. (I'm trying to get un-fat too.)

Love, Robyn Katie

[Virginia]

Robyn, CJ,

If you don't mind, I have been trying to understand what I think you are saying. One, if we were not a "leisure" society, our "gift" would be less apt to be prevalent in or to us or for others to quantify or qualify?

Second. that there is a possible measurable difference between the internalize femininity and externalize (expressed) femininity and the individual's want (desire) to express said desire. The expression manifests itself in various manners and "strengths/need to express it!? If that is what you are saying it parallels the difference between crossdressers and transgendered folk, even carrying over to those of our ilk who "go all the way" to transition as the desire of the "inner" woman just continues to grow and "force" her way to an altered state of being from what was original.

I still stand by my feelings that it is "a gift." Granted a complicated one for a lot of us, but still a gift and if understood to an operable degree and "properly" expressed, it can sure make our lives, can I say, a lot of fun!!!!

Love,

Virginia

[Azurielle]

I usually buy my things second-hand, since it's cheap, green and really cheap.

But, in all honesty, I think GGs and most of us consume way too much. I have a pair of flats, flip-flops and running shoes along with my male-mode boots and hiking shoes. That makes 5 pairs over 2 genders, but most GGs I know have at least 7 pairs and most have over 15! It's ridiculous mow much we overconsume!

This, however, might be due to my early 90s view of feminity where women wore skirts without being instantly objectified as a sex objects and when young girls wore sundresses and hairbows instead of tubetops and g-strings, so I'm kind of biased in the purity department, which is somehow inversely related to consumerism from what l've noticed.

[Robyn Katie]

Hi Virginia,

Good question. I'm afraid I muddled the point. I'll try to clarify.

I think in a war-torn or disaster-ridden society, gender issues, while internally they might be just as prevalent in us, might probably be submerged and largely ignored, or left unexplored for the time being, due to the dire necessity to just get by as a human being, regardless of gender.

That is, if you're starving, need shelter, fleeing from bandits or enemy soldiers or molten lava, it seems to me you (or at least I) might not have the time or space to indulge feelings of gender crossing, let alone to cross-dress or assume female roles.

I could be wrong. It could turn out I'd be out there starving, fighting, etc. in a dress ... I kind of like to think I would. But chances are I'd be wearing something warm and dry, regardless what its origin, and the expression of my femme self might have to wait on later opportunity. That was all I meant.

Your second question about difference between inner and outer femininity — well, each of us is different in our degree of contrast between our inner expression of femininity and our outer appearance, which can range all the way from conventional male attire right on up to full drag or assumption of a female role.

But beyond that, I don't know if I am qualified to answer you on that one. CJ, can you?

I also wanted to complete the thought in one of my posts above, where I mentioned each woman being just one in a host of fields that men are biologically set up to seek through. (Sounds like cliches. I really haven't expressed it very well.)

Main thing I wanted to say, though: how hard it is for either women or men to get beyond that mating urge to the point where they see each other as more than just instruments, more than just The Other: real human beings, understood as equivalent to themselves. When that point is reached, the couple can at last be full persons to one another, and all sorts of magic starts happening that isn't allowed for in the ordinary Hollywood-style romantic paradigm that breaks down so often. And that interrelationship can go beyond all conventional expressions of either masculinity or femininity.

Whew. Again I haven't managed to express it. Back to Square One some other day when my brain's not a blur. I hope it can make some sort of sense to you all even so.

Love, Robyn Katie

[Anita]

Hi All--
Thanks for setting up this thread, CJ. So many good replies!

I would agree that men who are transgendered can over-consume the feminine. I saw this when I was with my last girlfriend. I was extremely attracted to her, and then discovered that I was also wanting to become her in some way. It made me wonder if this was a logical extension of sexual attraction, or just an extreme reaction on my part. I'd been extremely attracted to some other girlfriends before her, too, and yet had not been aware of that "next step."

At any rate, some years later I went on to create my own version of a woman. I was not trying to become my girlfriend, per se, but she was one of the models that I was aware of when I began.

And yes, the inner vision had to become external. It was not enough to imagine it. It also wasn't enough to embody it for myself only, and I still don't fully understand all of the need for expressing it to the world at large. But that need was there, and nothing less than that was going to work.

We do seem to have an inbuilt desire for "more." I read a whole book that postulated that we're wired for that, as part of our survival. I also remember another self-help book that said clearly that if one wanted to live in the "now," and learn true gratitude for the moment, then they would have to learn how to ignore or transcend the constant need for "more."

I feel sorry for the TG women who are never satisfied with how they turned out, or who are always hoping for the next step. I am very grateful that for the most part, I'm satisfied with what I've been able to achieve as a woman.

[Mány B]

Hi all,

I absolutely agree on the issue of overconsumption. Regarding our situation, I would like to add that (IMHO) consumption has a lot to do with possession. An advertisement shows us something in the hope we would want to possess that article. In the same way we could have a desire to "posses" the beautiful girl we see on a billboard or walking in the street. One way of doing that would be to 'be' her, ( or trying to ).

Thanks for posting interesting reflections.