What's wrong with people? :P

General talk about CD/TGing and gender topics that aren't necessarily fun things we do while en femme, or for gender-driven discussions.

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Letitia_Jolie_GG
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What's wrong with people? :P

Post by Letitia_Jolie_GG »

So, this photo was posted on a blog, meant as a funny picture. http://grapefruits.files.wordpress.com/ ... apture.png (Might be photoshopped, but that's beside the point).
After a few (non-offensive, to my standards) reactions of: "Haha, that's funny", one poster writes: "He's gay". Next poster: "I *hope* this is photoshopped. I thought policemen were so attractive... never thought they could be gay".
Now, I might have over-reacted to a post that was merely meant to be funny, but this happens to be one of my pet peeves (since I happen to be not only the significant other of a keen panty- wearer :P but also a sociologist... so professional deformation, I guess).
So I write: as a matter of fact, most crossdressers are straight. According to the studies I've seen/what I've read about the issue, the percent of gay crossdressers is not bigger than the percent of gays in the population (actually, it seems it's even a bit smaller-not significantly, but there are more people who identify as bisexual than in the population, so it kind of evens out and the percents don't vary too significantly anyway). See also this link:http://www.yvonnesplace.net/survey/surv ... uality.htm So, in layman's terms, you can't guess the guy's sexual orientation based on the fact that he wears female panties better than you could, let's say, based on the fact that he is a cop . Now, I might have used a bit of specialized language, but do you honestly believe my explanation was hard to follow/read?
OK, nex poster: Maybe he lost a bet. Or he's gay. Or in his country they sell that in the Men's underwear area. Otherwise, I can't understand why he would do that
I write back: Or maybe men's underpants are just sooo uninteresting :P Jokes aside, if you're interested:there can be many explanations. Psychoanalysts believe that crossdressing is attractive to some men because it is a social taboo, so it is kind of aa fetish. However, this view is quite controversial in the academic world. Sociologists and semiologists believe that the question is a bit biased to begin with:in onder to understand theis phenomenon, we should ask ourselves not why do some men crossdress but why is crossdressing a taboo, or why are clothes gendered to begin with. It is also the paradigm that I agree with the most. What I find hard to understand, in exchange, is why someone would maintain that being gay may be a cause for crossdressing when just on the comment above there's a link to a study showing zero association between these variables?
To top it off, next poster:
He's gay.
Yeah righht, if you say so...
You know, this is really getting on my nerves: why do people believe so much that crossdressing (or even panty-wearing :P ) MUST be associated with being gay, evn if they have no evidence whatsoever to prove it?
Gender is not something that one is, it is something one does, an act… a "doing" rather than a "being". (Judith Butler)
DanteCarrie (FTM)
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Post by DanteCarrie (FTM) »

Maybe because genderbending tendencies are common among the LGBT community. But it still don't make sense particularly those people were bastards and clearly homophobic.
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Carol Ann
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Post by Carol Ann »

Letitia,
Well I understand fully what you are talking about as I hear comments all the time about a person must be a "fag". Gays and lesbians or open and people except them for what they are even through they may not like or approve of the lifestyle.

Now let someone talk about crossdressers or crossdressing and all kinds of names will come up to as what they are and what people will call them.

Me I don't give a damn as I have been dressing since I was 14 and going out in public all my life and if the world doesn't like it, thats their choise.

Honey I live in redneck, hillbilly country and believe me all you get here is people want to save your soul from hell, and yes you are looked down on and folks will turn their back on you. Hay so be it =D>
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Anne
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Post by Anne »

People fear what they don't understand. And men often lash out at non-masculine behavior.

Makes one wonder why they feel compelled to read the blog if they don't plan to read objectively.

Hang in there, Anne
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Leeza
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Post by Leeza »

Your posting reminded me of a couple of incidents that happened to me years ago.

The first was while I was working in the oil field. I could handle the cold as long as my nipples didn't get cold. If they got cold I was in enough pain that it was hard to work. When it got that cold I would put rags under my coveralls and over my nipples to help keep them warm. I had one guy that had been working with me refuse to work with me because he thought I was gay.

Years later I was working for another company and was attending a mine saftey class. The instructor was a hunter and fisherman and the topic was cold injuries. He made the comment that when he was going to be out in the cold for long periods he would put on ph as he had found they helped keep his legs and feet warm without adding a heavy layer. One of the loud mouths in the class as much as called him gay.

In both instances I figured it was guys who were so set in their ways that they didn't want a challange to their way of thinking even if thier way of thinking was wrong.

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Letitia_Jolie_GG
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Post by Letitia_Jolie_GG »

@ Carol Ann - I know what you're talking about, the country I live in isn't exactly tolerant either.
@DanteCarrie - Well, the data I know off suggests that quite a small percent of crossdressers are actually gay. (I don't know how many of the gays are crossdressers and I admit this may be relevant.). If you know of any studies in the field please let me know, I'm interested :)
Gender is not something that one is, it is something one does, an act… a "doing" rather than a "being". (Judith Butler)
Letitia_Jolie_GG
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Post by Letitia_Jolie_GG »

Leeza wrote: I had one guy that had been working with me refuse to work with me because he thought I was gay.
What can I say? I heard of people who label you as "gay" for enjoying opera and ballet shows. But even if your colleague happens to be openly homo, to refuse to work with him on the ground that he's gay is not only beyond rude, but also irrational. (Should I refuse to work with male coworkers on the ground that they're straight? :twisted: )
Leeza wrote: One of the loud mouths in the class as much as called him gay.
How outright rude and inconsiderate!!!
Gender is not something that one is, it is something one does, an act… a "doing" rather than a "being". (Judith Butler)
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Kyra
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Post by Kyra »

It's sad that people can't simply accept the behavior of others without ridicule.

When I was a teenager (many, many, moons ago) I used to "hang" with guys in the mechanics shop at school. I was trying to be cool. This kind of trash talk was common there as well. I am very familiar with the dialogue. In my attempt to gain acceptance, I too, would lash out and sneer at some of the other kids. Afterwards, I would feel ashamed of myself for doing so.
Looking back, I wish I'd had the courage to stand up for who I am. I'm not very proud of what I did during that time.

I guess that's just part of growing up, eh? It was a learning experience for me. I'm a better person now because of what transpired then.

Maybe some people just don't learn as quickly...or at all.


Sad.

Kind regards,
Kyra
For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards, for there you have been and there you will long to return. - Leonardo DaVinci
Letitia_Jolie_GG
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Post by Letitia_Jolie_GG »

What amuses me the most is how they just ignore my (I believe- pertinent) observations and have their say without even an attempt at contradicting me.
Gender is not something that one is, it is something one does, an act… a "doing" rather than a "being". (Judith Butler)
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Absaroka
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Post by Absaroka »

Some people are just poorly informed, often at the hands of people they respect, like their parents.

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Virginia
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Post by Virginia »

I think the major reasons have been eluded to above.
1. Ignorance
2. People so set in their ways they refuse to accept/understand anything outside of their own universe of understanding.
3. Human nature to fall back on socio/economic/education (lack there of) about things that they don't understand.

There is a personality who had a program on the media and he sends a "reporter" out among "the masses" and asks "the person on the street" some basic quesions that you would think people should know. Who is the vice-President; Sect of State. Governor (of that given state) How many states are there in the USA? Most = the majority of them can't answer correctly any of the questions. Does that reflect on the educational system?

Tolerance is a virtue that is (in my humble opinion) sadly lacking most everywhere.

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Davita
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I'm just glad that we can be the new hated group

Post by Davita »

It shows we are finally getting recognition. It also means the gays and others are being tolerated more.
{squeezes}
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MsJoann
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Post by MsJoann »

Just last week, a 41 year old crossdresser was found dead (natural causes) behiind a restaurant. His dog was found with him.
Well the local radio news made no bones about a "man found crossdressed". This was wrong.
The local newspaper made no comment about how he was dressed at all. Another local newspaper went off on how a crossdresser was found dead. The person who wrote that article had quickly re-wrote the article after numerous "reader's comments" were left attached to the story.
The poor guy has died. Why the sensationalism which ruined his memory? You're right...what's wrong with some people!
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Gillian
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Post by Gillian »

To use the quote,"stupid is as stupid does". I have found that many beer swilling rednecks thought that they "arrived" in life after graduating grade six and there is nothing more to learn. Ignorance has and will always be a problem in a prejudiced world. If you want to see redneck life and homophobia first hand, look no farther than most heavy industry. Mining, smelting, logging, or the oil patch, many of them think that the macho thing to do is drink yourself stupid. That is about 12oz! They ignore there wives and children, and guess what, there son grow up to be like them. What a sad state, knowledge is the only thing that will change this.
So I concluded that there is nothing better for people than to be happy and to enjoy themselves as long as they can. People should eat and drink and enjoy the fruits of there labor, for these are gifts from God.
DanteCarrie (FTM)
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Post by DanteCarrie (FTM) »

Letitia_Jolie_SO wrote:@ Carol Ann - I know what you're talking about, the country I live in isn't exactly tolerant either.
@DanteCarrie - Well, the data I know off suggests that quite a small percent of crossdressers are actually gay. (I don't know how many of the gays are crossdressers and I admit this may be relevant.). If you know of any studies in the field please let me know, I'm interested :)
no I didn't say many gays have crossdressing tendencies. i said the LGBT community tends to have more gender bending traits and are percieved by that. Yes way more straight men cross dress than gay men but its often in private but being part of an LGBT community i know we can be a bit 'camp' in a vairiety of ways according to straights. I'm the only one of my LGBT mates who wears the opposite sexes clothes but many of us dress in a way that would be considered genderbendy by straightos.
i.e. some of my guy friends wear eye liner and tight colourful clothes while me and some of the girls tend to wear stuff that is more typically masculine or at least not girly.
I think this lack of fear in the LGBT community this less addiction to super heteronormative attire and behaviour means that people associate us with genderbending traits hence idiots assume that crossdressers are gay.
which is of course ridiculous as many gays i know are really not genderbendy at all and some straights i know are. people are going by percieved generalisations and notions that aren't even legitimate.
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