Fetishes

[Gillian]

So here are the simple questions: Are fetishes good or bad? What makes some more acceptable than others? Are some humans more predisposed to certain fetishes? Do we all have fetishes, but some are better hidden than others? Are some fetishisms milder, and some more extreme?

Does some or all of your CD habits possibily fit into this arena?


In and of itself, I do not see where fetishes are such a big deal. If it is not harming anyone, then so what. I remember reading once about a guy who said that he could not get it on with a girl unless he had his cowboy boots on. Well if she didn't mind, so what. The only problem is if they stopped making cowboy boots, then this guy might be in trouble! The only thing I can not figure is are some of us predisposed to a fetish? Did I choose, or was there something that lead me toward it?


** Two (2) successive posts combined into one (1) by SL. **

[Absaroka]

If fetishes aren't harming anyone, I don't see them as either good or bad. They just are. I guess you could say they are neutral.

They've gotten bad press for a couple of reasons. One is that a few of them are harmful to others. The other however is just our discomfort with anything having to do with sex. if it's unusual that leads to even more discomfort.


Absaroka

[DonnaT]

I agree, if there are no victims, then no problem, unless you are the victim. That being, you can't perform without using the fetish as a crutch. Your partner may not be into the fetish, and as such, intimacy will be lacking.

[Absaroka]

Donna makes a very good point. At that point the fetish would be more like a situational obsession, and obsessions, even if they aren't actually bad, something that leads to limitations in our life.

[Paulette]

A sexual fetish is something that one is sexually aroused by that ordinarily has little or nothing to do with sex, or that is necessary for any sexual arousal at all. So, to the extent that arousal can be achieved only through fetish behavior or fetish objects, it severely limits the possibilities of sexual expression. It's this exclusion of all other sources of arousal that makes a fetish peculiar. However, whatever pickles your nuppers.

Any practice that is not exclusive, that can be indulged in or not while achieving sexual arousal and satisfaction is simply a sexual preference of the moment.

Some defining examples:

I like younger women. My wife likes older men. These are preferences we enjoy with each other, but they are not exclusive preferences, so they are not fetishes even though our age difference of 29 years may make others uncomfortable. We've both of us have loved and enjoyed sex with people our own age. On the other hand, my first wife only enjoyed sex that was dirty or debasing or that hurt her. She'd put up with and fake the enjoyment of more ordinary sex, but got no real pleasure from it. I didn't discover the depth or exclusivity of her fetishes (being selfishly involved with my own enjoyment - I was young and stupid) until some eighteen months into our marriage. Then I found it repellent. Now I no longer find it repellent, but simply dull and limiting.

Today, I sometimes like making love to my wife while I'm dressed as a woman. It makes me feel sexy and desirable, and it gives me an opportunity to switch from dominant aggressor to being a submissive and passive participant. I like both, and now that I can freely indulge in either, I no longer feel compelled to do one or the other - it's become a matter of preference of the moment. At the same time, my wife is somewhat bi-sexual, and enjoys having the pleasures of being married to both a man and, to the extent I can manage it, a woman, all in one person.

I prefer freedom of sexual expression. However, I understand the intense pleasure of compulsive and ritualized sexual behavior as well. I just don't feel compelled to perform it or think that that is the only form sex I want.

YMMV, but that's the meaning of sexual fetish to me.

[Anthony Simon]

I confess to really disliking the term "fetish" when applied to CDing. What people mean when they use it is CDing that has a central element sexual gratification. My preconceptions are fashioned from my hearing the word in two previous usages. Like you can have shoe fetishes (for example) where a guy is turned on by women's shoes - "sexy" women's underwear seems to fit in the same box. Then you can have fetishes in anthropology - where they seem to stand for some weird and othering aspect of a culture's religious experience where objects (the fetishes) take on disconcerting powers connecting the real world with the spiritual world.

In CDing I always hear "fetish CDing" as sexual and in some way beyond the pale. Like weird and othering in rather the same way as the anthropological meaning, but with the added connotation of a sexual peversion. So this is basically the concept of CDing as a paraphilia - except, by implication,the forms of CDing that don't involve sexual release aren't paraphilias.

The odd thing about my CDing - which is solitary and has a strong sexual element - is that it tends to bleed into the outside world. Like, if I have a particularly intense engagement with it one night, the mood from it can continue into the next day. Sometimes that can leave me in the zone of being very turned on by women. Other times it can have me identifying with women. In both cases the women tend to pick it up and react accordingly.

What seems to be happening is that I'm rather an repressed guy and my freeing up of my fantasies in the CDing carries on even when I'm out of the clothes. The standard view of CDing as fetishist is of it cutting you off from the outside world sexually - that's what I take the standard use of "fetish CDing" to mean. But, in the way I'm describing above, the opposite seems to be the case with me. It rather seems to be a bridge.

[Sarah Ann]

(Deep sigh) Ok girls, I'm going over to HT to respond to this. Follow me if you can (or dare )

[Paulette]

First, Anthony, I've got to say that I think we're talking about the same thing, and I feel pretty much the same way about my own CDing. Yet I know we're all different. I'm easier than you are with the term 'fetish', but then I'm a word nerd and Free Speech Movement graduate, so sticks and stones can hurt, but never words.

And Sarah Ann, WTF is HT? I want to hear what you have to say, babe.

(And I love that to actully post something to these forums one has to push "Submit" !)

[Gillian]

Have a look in the Hot topics section.

[Sarah Ann]

Ohhh, yeah, we want Paulette in on this for sure .

OMG, "Submit" -- that's priceless! Like Gillian said, we're doing the more serious grubbing around on this over in Hot Topics to have greater freedom to explore it and say the outrageous when necessary.

[Anthony Simon]

I don't think you need the freedom to get outrageous to get serious.

[Sarah Ann]

Oooooh, too serious

The Hot Topics rules allow the discussion of aspects of this matter which are plainly forbidden in the other subforums. I was simply being a little lighthearted about it.

[Amanda M]

A fetish is by and large (like most behavior) learned response. In other words, you tried it once and liked it. You tried it again and loved it. You tried it again, and nothing else will ever be as good. Simplistic, but true.

Good fetishes or bad fetishes - well my take on this is simple. Those fetishes which are "bad" are those that involve other people (or the fetishist himself or herself ) being abused exploited or hurt, whether mentally or physically or emotionally. Or those whichsubstantially interfere with one's normal life or social intercourse.

The rest are simply whatever floats your boat.

There is however, and area in which being hurt etc is part of the fetish itself. Normally, people are able to indulge safely in these areas, but there is a very fine dividing line (in sadism or masochism) between acceptability and psychopathic behavior. There are more fatalities in the practice of auto-eroticism than one might imagine.

For most of us it's something to enjoy from time to time, thank goodness.

[Ralitsa]

I don't like the term "fetish" at all, because I don't understand what it is supposed to mean. I hear people use it to imply that the subject of the conversation is some sort of deviant socio-path. I hear others use it to try to sell various novelties. I hear it used to mean just something of a personality quirk. What sort of behaviors qualify as a fetish? Fishing? Golf? Football? Baking? Scrapbooking? Stamp-collecting? Photography? Wearing hats? Drinking wine? Smoking?
How can you say: "this thing that you do is a festish"? What is the difference between a fetish, and a hobby, and an addiction, and a perversion, and a sign of mental instability, or simply an innocent diversion?
For example, my brother is not interested in having a job, but he will get up at 0300 to drive 100 miles so that he can go sit in his boat, in the rain, on a lake when it is 35 degrees, in hopes of catching a few smelly slimy fish that may have 3 lbs of meat on them. And he thinks I'm weird because I like wearing dresses. Somehow I just can't give much serious consideration to the opinions of such people. Not that I dislike my brother, but I don't trust his judgement.
So that's just an example, but the point is that I don't have any good reason to think that someone else's opinion on any subject is better than my own.

[Paulette]

How can you say: "this thing that you do is a festish"? What is the difference between a fetish, and a hobby, and an addiction, and a perversion, and a sign of mental instability, or simply an innocent diversion?

At its simplest, a fetish is something that takes the place of something else. It's not a symbol of something, it replaces it and provides the same effect/result.

In sexual behavior a fetish is an activity that takes the place of the activity of intercourse and gives the satisfaction that intercourse usually gives.

A sexual fetish can be a hobby that may be shared with others of the same inclination. It can also be an addiction or a perversion, depending on whether one can refrain from that behavior or whether it somehow offends someones sensibilities. Sometimes something is a fetish

because

the person doing it feels it is perverse.

Hope that helps.