Femaleness or femininity?

[Paige]

By Golly Miss Darla,

You sure got me thinking. Thanks for your insight!!

Hugs, Paige

[Virginia]

Well I am not as articulate as many of my sisters here and have failed many times to express myself and my feelings adequately but I will keep trying, not that it is important.
First, thanks to each of my sisters who posted above. I can only say that this is only me responding. I love reading how others view themselves and I try very hard to determine if any of their interpretations can be transferred to Virginia. Such as what Darla said about "escaping from the male." so interesting a take on it. I thought about that but, not me.
If I was asked I would say that so far the only thing I can point to that seems to "make me tick!" is Jung and his Anima theory. The feminne aspect of my existence was always there, it emerged a various times during my life, but I did not understand it so I supressed/repressed it up until the time about three years ago that it, my anima, basically said, "listen I have been supressed long enough, I have something good to give you and want you to take it (the gift) and share it with everyone you come into contact with. Oh, it has a few strings attached, like your family may disown you, people may question your sanity, society may shun you, but it will make you happy, you happy, you happy." BANG and now although I enjoy studing about how my sisters view this in their own lives and to see if I can take any of their understanding and broaden my understanding. BUT for me I love who I am I love what Virginia does for me and though I may never completely understand it , it would be very difficult to find anyone who is enjoying their own "Magical Mystery Tour" more than I am!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I love you all,
Virginia

[Marlena Dahlstrom]

I should point out that "escaping the male" is something that can definitely co-exist with other factors.

If various personality tests are to be believed, I've got a fairly androgynous personality -- and some folks have taken the strong femme aspects of my personality to assume that I must want to transition. (Personally, since I'm happy in my male body, and with being a guy most of the time, I can't see that happening.) This did cause me to have a lot of questioning about the male gender role when I was younger, and to me being en femme is a chance to express parts of my personality that are harder/less socially acceptable to express while en homme.

But because my self-acknowledged androgy, my femme aspects are allowed to surface more en homme than for a lot of people. I work in a "creative" profession, so I can be a bit of metrosexual and it's OK to be expressive. Consequently, I think the pendulum swing between en homme and en femme is probably less for me than for other folks who inhabit more stereotypical macho/logical roles while en homme. Which may be why I don't feel the need to be a girly girl. Feminine, yes. Cloying, no.

[Loretta Ann]

Hi all,

I don't think the transgendered person exists that does not attempt to escape and/or repress the male. Some just need to do it more than others.

[Beauty]

Hi Lorretta,

I don't feel like I'm escaping or repressing maleness. I'm TG'd.

Gracie

[Loretta Ann]

Beauty,

I know you have felt like that for some time now and you are certainly free to feel that way. However (and this is not to say you are wrong) but in order for me to understand that: I would need an explanation (that I can understand) as why you got rid of your male hair.

[Beauty]

Hi again,

I got rid of the hair on my face. It wasn't male hair, it was hair. You should have seen the before photos of GGs who had hair on their faces. It wasn't male hair, it was just hair.

Gracie

[Marlena Dahlstrom]

You should have seen the before photos of GGs who had hair on their faces.

I can imagine. Back in college there was a female instructor who had a far better mustache than I could ever grow, poor dear....and no, I'm not exagerating. I guess she must have been in denial.

[Loretta Ann]

Darla,

Could she grow a beard as well?

I have seen some women with facial hair, but it was short and finer. She did not have to shave it and in fact locked very neat. (and yes it was black hair.) I have also seen some with a pretty good display of leg hair, but none with as much hair as I have. (not even close)

This only goes to support something I have said here before. And that is that I believe there is no such thing as male or female, but we are all a mixture.

As for being in denial...Could be...Being as no one is perfect I guess we all are in denial to some extent, with some things. There are areas in each ones life (things we don't understand.) That translates into an area where we have blinders on, and this may be one of mine.

If one is getting rid of something that they were born with they are escaping something, No? I guess you can put your own label on it.

[Beauty]

If one is getting rid of something that they were born with they are escaping something, No? I guess you can put your own label on it.[/color]

Hi,

No I don't think they are. Ok, I'll put my own label on it.

I do think that for the most part Loretta, especially in the CD'ing part of the TG'd umbrella you're right, and your thoughts are still valid even if I don't fit. I fit in a lot of other stuff though.

Gracie

[Kerri]

I have never seen a need for assuming a female identity when dressed.
I have adopted these identities only to conform to other peoples ideals, for a quiet life.

Being dressed in feminine garb allows me to express my inner self. I feel wrong when in drab, and always have felt that way.

I can never experience motherhood and all that, that entails. But I can feel envy and do, often. I see no point in sexual reassignment surgery, because it is only skin deep.

To sum up, if I could achieve the impossible I would strive to be female!
I would love to able to live and express my feminine side free of prejudice.

I find this thought process too painful to continue, I have been given but one chance at life. I should thank god for my health and be grateful for all the joy this life has brought me. I love my wife and my children, and wish that I could have lived my life as a man, without the sorrow being male has brought me.

This is a good post, but thinking about it cracks me up!

Tara!

kerri

[Georgia(SO)]

I found Darla's discussion of "escaping the male" to be quite interesting. It is something that I see in my sweetie, and, occasionally in the CDs on this site. Disclaimer, disclaimer, disclaimer...I do not mean to imply that this applies to all...

Early on, I asked the SOs why they thought many of ya'll refer to being dressed as a male as being "en drab" instead of "en homme." None of us gg's really knew, except to assume that ya'll find boy clothes to be boring, but I've always had a gut feeling that calling your male personnas "en drab" exhibited a bit of a wish to escape maleness, or societally acceptable maleness, like maybe ya'll didn't fundamentally like being male...

Further, my sweetie does tend to dress more in times of stress - particularly the type of stress that is based on his perception that he is not meeting the expectations of a man as "Provider", "Competent Business Man", etc. Yes, those are in quotes because they are roles. Because he is self-employed in a home based business, he is free to dress at work more so than those of ya'll who have to trudge into the office. And it is not uncommon for him to carry on a stressful business conversation fully dressed. Somehow it makes him feel more powerful and, quite frankly, he often is more effective in business calls when he's wearing a skirt than when he's in jeans or sweats. His voice doesn't change, nor does he say silly girl things, even if he is wearing a cute little tennis skirt and frilly top, but it's like his brain is significantly more focused.

Now whether this is a personal thing related to his powerful mother, or related to the powerful women whom he has loved and lived with, or what, I don't really know. I do know that he, and many other men, claim that "women have all the power." They are often referring to the standard bar/dating scene, where the guy asks the woman to dance and she has the power to say no. (Now, I'll argue that we gg's *don't* have all that much power as we have to sit there trying to give the guy clues that we *would* like to dance without looking slutty or scaring the holy hell out of him by asking *him* to dance, but that's another post!)

Sorry, I seem to be rambling this morning, but yes, for many CDs, dressing does appear to be a way to escape the societal mold for appropriate male behavior. Then, depending on the core personality of the individual person, some of you guys seem to be quite happy escaping just into fancier clothes, while others, like my guy, will escape into a totally different type of person.

Just my observation from the grandstand...

-georgia(so)

[DonnaT]

Early on, I asked the SOs why they thought many of ya'll refer to being dressed as a male as being "en drab" instead of "en homme." None of us gg's really knew, except to assume that ya'll find boy clothes to be boring, but I've always had a gut feeling that calling your male personnas "en drab" exhibited a bit of a wish to escape maleness, or societally acceptable maleness, like maybe ya'll didn't fundamentally like being male...

For me, 'drab' is just an easier term to remember and to use. I don't recall ever using 'en homme', probably because it isn't frequently used by most TGs.

[Marlena Dahlstrom]

Let start with my standard disclaimer that my comment only describe some of us -- those who CD more out of gender role discomfort than feelings of being in the wrong body.

Early on, I asked the SOs why they thought many of ya'll refer to being dressed as a male as being "en drab" instead of "en homme.")

I agree, I find our choice of descriptions symbolic. Unfortunately, I've seen CDs en homme who really do look drab -- and it's more than just the clothes. I guess the best analogy would be the "before" appearance some of the fashion victims on "What Not to Wear." I thinking of those who look frumpy and frazzled and just generally worn down, which seems to reflect how they view life at the time.

Further, my sweetie does tend to dress more in times of stress

From what I've seen, CDing as a form of stress relief is pretty common.

- particularly the type of stress that is based on his perception that he is not meeting the expectations of a man as "Provider", "Competent Business Man", etc. Yes, those are in quotes because they are roles.

Exactly. In that sense, CDing for me is in part a chance to adopt another role(s) for awhile.

Somehow it makes him feel more powerful and, quite frankly, he often is more effective in business calls when he's wearing a skirt than when he's in jeans or sweats. His voice doesn't change, nor does he say silly girl things, even if he is wearing a cute little tennis skirt and frilly top, but it's like his brain is significantly more focused.

I wouldn't presume to guess all the reasons why this might be so, but I think there's a couple possible reasons.

There's a good analogy from the Myers-Briggs personality test. Essentially, MB argues people have natural temperments (such as being extrovert vs. introverted) but one can do things that don't come "naturally," it just takes a lot more effort -- sort of like using your opposite hand to write with. So if you feel like you're an uncomfortable fit into the masculine gender role, it takes some effort to maintain that facade. (This may also be why being en femme is often relaxing.) So if you're en femme, you're not feeling that need and therefore feel more energetic and focused.

The another factor may be that I find if you're "somebody else" it's easier to deal with rejection -- whether in business or in person. (Granted your husband's clients don't know he's en femme, but your husband knows.) Because I'm a bit socially awkward around strangers in guy-mode, I've consciously used Darla as a way to be more of the social butterfly when out in public.

I do know that he, and many other men, claim that "women have all the power." They are often referring to the standard bar/dating scene, where the guy asks the woman to dance and she has the power to say no. (Now, I'll argue that we gg's *don't* have all that much power as we have to sit there trying to give the guy clues that we *would* like to dance without looking slutty or scaring the holy hell out of him by asking *him* to dance, but that's another post!)

Well, I suspect both genders have a fair amount of "grass is greener" envies about the opposite gender role, which is disconnected from the realities what it's like to live that role. So a lot of the behavior I see does seem to reflect that.

If you're stressed out from running a business, it's nice to change pace to have the biggest decision be about whether the purse matches the shoes -- never mind that that's far from reality. But to me that does account for the "teenage girl" behavior I see among a lot of CDs.

Then, depending on the core personality of the individual person, some of you guys seem to be quite happy escaping just into fancier clothes, while others, like my guy, will escape into a totally different type of person.

Part of it may be the motivations as well. Some CDs seem to be into it mostly for the sensuousness of it, rather than feeling they've got a feminine aspect they need to express. So for them, it really it mostly just about the clothes. It will be interesting to see if the metrosexual revolution might cause some of these folks to be able to satisfy those urges en homme.

And of course, there's the larger issue of whether changing gender roles will allow some men the freedom to express their "feminine" sides without feeling the need to cross-dress to do so. I don't have any formal statistics to back this up, but my impression is that there seem to be more CDs who come from socially conservative backgrounds where gender roles are defined more rigidly.

Of course, it's not only men who will need to allow more flexibility in gender roles, but equally importantly women will need to allow men that freedom too.

I was sadden to read in yestersday's newspaper about one woman's reaction to a charity "metrosexual ngiht" held at a spa in San Francisco -- "I need a drink just to deal with the sight of this," said Shannon Bravaro, a plastic surgery office manager, as she surveyed the scene. "I have men who get face-lifts, but it doesn't bother me. It's medically-oriented. Walking into my regular salon and seeing the most macho young businessmen in San Francisco with their pant legs rolled up and their hands soaking in dishes really freaks me out." If we get that kind of reaction, you can bet most guys will never give it another try -- although these guys were self-confident enough to admit it was something they'd enjoy doing again.

Anyway, I'm rambling on myself...

[Georgia(SO)]

Trisha kindly emailed me privately to tell me that DRAB meant Dressed As a Boy, as opposed to DRAG, meaning Dressed as a Girl. Oh. Sorry about that...

-g(so)