Crossdressers-Haven.com

Ive been talking to lots of people just of late. (Yes shock horror, no change there, right? ) Without going into the 'ins and outs', I've found that quite a few people in the trans community suffer from a more than average dose of 'self-loathing'. I know i do, and in part it forms some of the drive to change. Okay, we'd all like to look different, but i mean deeper than that, such as make permanent changes to our bodies, or do you feel clumsy all the time like the elephant in the room?, or obsess that youre annoying and stuff like that?. I'm wondering if this is as common eleswhere as it appears to be in the circles i move in?

I know theres many out there that dont get all bent up about themselves, but is this personal loathing of oneself more common in our community than the rest of the world?

Humour me! okay:)

I've lived with clinical depression since adolescence, and it's always clouded my already confused self-image. But I learned you can't give in to those negative ideas and thoughts, no matter how much they gnaw at you. Focus instead on the positives, and how they improve your quality of life. Then work constructively on those things in between the good and bad, so that you're more happy with them.

Which reminds me, I seriously need to lose a LOT of weight. It's not good for either my physical or mental health.

Alright, I'll bite...

I guess there's 3 forms of self-loathing I can think of. There's the kind of generalised "I loathe myself", which can be a sort of bug in your soul that never seems to go away.

There's the more specialised "I hate myself for being a CD. Why, oh why can't I be like everyone else". Which is another bug in the soul type thing.

And then there's the pre-op TS "I hate my body, especially the male bits" self-loathing.

OK, here's a 4th. Being a Jew, I'm aware of a particular form of self-loathing called Jewish self-hatred - which I have a bit of. It kind of involves wishing away characteristic Jewish qualities - like having dark hair, a someone prominent nose, not being physically strong and being intellectual. There's books on this stuff (of which I have one) - and they make it absolutely clear that this sort of self-hatred is the result of internalising the mores of the culture around.

On that basis, I'm pretty sure that the sort of self-loathing that CDs suffer comes, in very large part, from the same place.

Oh, alright...Here's a 5th form of self-loathing (I bet you wish you'd never started the thread now K.). That is what Freud calls melancholia. In that, you internalise the negative view of (probably) one particular individual about you - and it becomes your own view of yourself. I've definitely suffered from that (maybe even still do).

Probably the majority of CDs have suffered from the 2nd sort of self-loathing (also including me). That would have to be a much higher % of us who suffer from self-loathing than the general populace.

With the Freud thing you get weird pyschological games happening on the inside of your head. Like some else's problem ends up as yours. It might also be possible (maybe) for a loathing one has about oneself arising from one source to kind of move about in one's skull until one experiences it as being about something entirely different.

muahahahaha

I think i've put an interesting spin on this. I've taken my internal self loathing and refocused it outward, it is sooooo much easier to loath everyone else around me yanno????

Yeah, i joke.

Seriously tho, i pretty much have done the work on the self loathing (of the shame and guilt for my gender variance) thing, thru counseling and all that good stuff. Which is not to say i don't have lots of hard thoughts about my image and spend a good deal of time hating the way i look.
Or more precisely, that i don't look more like a woman when fully done up. This is then transferred into alot of envy/jealousy of attractive women and a quite alot of resulting sadness.

But yeah, i tend to agree with you luv, i do think we have a whole lot more of self esteem / body image / issues than the general male populace. Tho, i really doubt we have as much as genetic females.

No self loathing on my part.

http://www.myhusbandbetty.com/2012/12/0 ... r-project/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I think anyone who feels different is susceptable to these feelings. Look at how radical the Black is beautiful idea was when it was first expressed.

Absaroka

I've also suffered from self loathing, ever since being a teenager. It started with puberty, as I didn't like the body hair etc and often wished that I could be a girl. Since then it has been various things but my focus has gone back to the hair, fat distribution, etc again. For. Long time I simply blamed it all on depression but I now question that previous self diagnosis. I don't hate being a crossdresser, I only hate that some others don't accept me like that. I dare suggest that I agree with Karins observation though.

Luv,
Em

I think that loathing might be too strong a word for my feelings, but guilt and shame certainly come into play. I've been dressing on and off since I was 8, and have always had an irrational fear about being seen. I'm finally (almost) to the point where I don't care so much, but I still get that adrenaline rush when I hear someone moving around upstairs. My wife knows but is not accepting and my daughter has no clue (only 9). I would love for them to be okay with it, so I could just be myself around the house, but I think that's still a ways off.
Honestly, though, I think she's more upset about my spending the money to build the wardrobe back up than about the actual dressing. I guess that's what I hate about it the most - how it makes the people around me uncomfortable.

Perhaps there is something wrong with me but I don't loath or feel ashamed for being who I am. That being said am like a hermit crab if anybody comes along I withdraw into the safety of my shell. But Then I am closeted. If I feel the slightest pressure that I should not dress - I don't. Who wants to dress around those who do not approve or fully accept you for who you are. I am sensitive to that. It is wrong to force myself on others my belief. But, I let my speculation about what others may or may not think about me place me in a cage of my own making.

our perspective has a lot to do with how we think and feel. Were someone to discover my "habit" I could only state yes I have enjoyed and wanted to dress and feel feminine since I was about 9 years old - fact, a fact that I cannot change about myself but it is not something people talk about openly.

On the other hand if your self loathing has come to you after making irreversible changes to your body, then you made a mistake - you're a cross dresser and were not trans gendered after all. Now you have to get over your regrets or start saving money to reverse what you can.

That's the best I can come up with right now.

At risk of repeating what I and others have said before, there is nothing 'wrong' with you my dear. People are all unique, so I won't even begin to talk about 'normality' because i'll just go off on a rant...

Like you I am not ashamed of who I am, and I think that is healthy. Similarly I wouldn't make any permanent changes to my body for fear that I might later regret my choices. But some people have done that....

luv,
Em

Anne Bonny wrote:On the other hand if your self loathing has come to you after making irreversible changes to your body, then you made a mistake - you're a cross dresser and were not trans gendered after all. Now you have to get over your regrets or start saving money to reverse what you can.

.

Emma-A wrote: Similarly I wouldn't make any permanent changes to my body for fear that I might later regret my choices. But some people have done that....

Interesting.....

*Dons her pink helmet and hopes SL doesnt see her borrow that oh so cute pink hand grenade...

When i started this thread i was thinking more about loathing of the 'original' person(a) and that its kinda common in broken people to come forth and embrace what we does?
Sorta maybe that we either inherit issues from birth, or somewhere along the path of life that makes us look at ourselves and want to barf up all over the place. sometimes its physical, sometimes its mental, and for some its both. So i was asking if this is a cause or telltale of trans or cd issues. if the percentage of us here were higher than that of non trans then maybe it is..

For me, yes ive begun changing things and cant do it fast enough. I regret nothing other than not doing it twenty years ago. I think its pretty obvious to ourselves to know what we like and feel. I know where i need to be, the hard bit is accepting. i dont understand the notion of 'if i ever regret these changes it means im a crossdresser' at all? taking that stance further could imply all cd'ers are just unsure of themselves so thats why they only take it so far? Or is TG just an extreme cd'er?? Personally i think thats pretty blinkered, cos we do what we do to survive as we can...

*hides behind a big pink tank

Karin, perhaps my original comment about making 'permanent changes' needed qualification. I was referring primarily so SRS. I don't consider what you have done thus far to be permanent. You could with time reverse most of those changes I guess, unless I''ve missed something.

Emma-A wrote:Karin, perhaps my original comment about making 'permanent changes' needed qualification. I was referring primarily so SRS. I don't consider what you have done thus far to be permanent. You could with time reverse most of those changes I guess, unless I''ve missed something.

Well with the exception of the sterilisation and breast growth i guess i could, but i also intend on having FFS and SRS too so its all the same to me really Emma, the thought that someone like me might do it then regret it is valid. but the implication that would make me a just a crossdresser only is very shortsighted if you think about it? wouldnt it depend on the REASONS for regret for instance...hint hint...I guess you have to experience it to understand what im saying maybe...

Karin -

I don't mind you borrowing my cute pink hand grenade, nor my big pink tank for that matter . . . just remember to return them when you're done, and don't forget to re-stock and re-fuel the tank, too.


- SL