stupid pushing it stuff

[KimberlyS]

Why do us Men in general and us as CDers specifically, push the acceptance and bounderies of our SO. And often in my case because I am being blind to the whole situation. All my wife has asked it to be open and honest and no surprises. My mind messes with me some times, and what can be done over powers what should be done. I reference my femme week post from two weeks back:

http://crossdressers-haven.com/forums/v ... php?t=6712

So many CDers stuggle with going out. Going out for me has never really been an issue as it can be done passing or not, but done in the right environment and attire. But going out as a guy in femme clothes to public stores in my home town was just stupid as I know way too many people there. What was I thinking!!!!!!! Was I thinking!!!!!!! Going to my therapy session was fairly safe, but in my home town in very public places in half and half mode is not. I really wonder what is in my head sometimes. Yes it can be done, but what is the outing myself factor there. Am I ready to be outed? NO. I can go out, I just need to be safe about it.

I told my wife "until such time as I can go to the hardware store in an old jean skirt, casual top, steel toe work boots and a two day beard and be accepted, I would only leave the house/hotel presenting a male or female that society could accept". Give be a 2x4 so I can beat it into my head. Give my wife the 2x4 I am sure she would like a few swings.

I am trying to figure out what I need as a CDer, not trying to prove I can be stupid male. Who says only blondes can have air head moments. And I seem to be having more of them lately.



>>>> end of vent.

[CJ]

Hi all,

Kim,

I sympathize. I do. I don't have any spare 2x4's handy at the moment and if I did I'd wouldn't hand you one, of course. The toughest part of this kind of issue, as you yourself hinted at, is finding out what you want for yourself (hey, this is where I'm at, too). Out? Not out? Total trans? Strictly underdress? Embrace androgyny? Be a stylish iconoclast? It's hard to work these things out sometimes.

There are no "crossdressers," only this or that crossdresser.
There are no "transsexuals," only this or that transsexual.
There are no "SO's," only this or that SO.

The only piece of advice I can give (and, yes, I know it's unsollicited) is this: communicate and compromise but never cower. As human beings, we have no higher duty than exploring who we are so that we may better embrace who we are. All else--compassion, understanding, tolerance, passion, openness, curiosity, wisdom, receptivity, flexibility, moral strength, maturity, emotional stability--flows from this (self-)embrace. In a way, we are all "called" to become ourselves. And, yes, of course, so are our partners, wives, family members, etc. Hence, communicate and compromise. But. Never. Cower.

Going out as a guy in femme clothes to public stores in your home town is only stupid if you also believe that a guy in femme clothes is, in itself, a stupid thing. This is not a criticism, by the way, Kimberly. Far from it. We just need to remember sometimes how powerful an effect our own often subconscious beliefs can have on our behaviour. Truly, it's a case of "laugh, and the whole world will laugh along with you." There's enough experiential evidence, even right here, on this very forum, to suggest that people are drawn to those who do not shy away from being who they are; in the presence or in the company of such "self-embracers," they often feel that they're that much more free, in a way, to be themselves as well. It can be a very liberating thing all around. So, please, don't berate yourself too much.

And, maybe, for the time being, you should try to stay away from any construction site or workshop (or any other place where 2x4's are easily obtainable).

Love,
CJ

[DonnaT]

I don't know why you do it Kimberly, but I do it too.

Why? Because I don't want to be limited. I want to be free to express myself as I desire.

So, there's compromise, and once she gets use to that, there's push. Without the push, the limits would never have changed, and I'd still be in the closet.

The other day I wore my sandles outside showing my painted toes. Took the dog for a ride and took the trash to the county landfill. Outer clothes were male (shorts and t-shirt). Jewelry was a ladies watch, pearl pinkie ring, a bracelet and earrings.

When I got back, my wife noticed the sandles and commented that I was being bad. She then asked if I wanted to go with her to the store. Sure, as long as I could go as is. So off we went. However, when we got there she wanted me to remove the watch.



She said people would notice. I thought, yea, so what? Like they won't notice the other jewelry and the painted toes? Didn't say it out loud though

It took a while to get her use to the idea of me wearing the other jewelry, so it may take a while to get her to let me wear the watch.

Hopefully I won't push too hard and find myself freer than intended.

[KimberlyS]

CJ, Thank you for your reply. I was not sure how anyone was going to reply to my rant/self beating. But I do so welcome all replies to any of my postings as I feel that is what this forum is about and how we learn is through discussions with others. So you really think I should stay away from the lumber yard this weekend??

As far as how I was "STUPID" I should clarify. I do not think it is stupid for a guy to be in a skirt or other femme clothes and be in public, or else I would not have done it. I do think since that the fact is that I am not currently ready to come out to everyone and in fact far from that point and my wife is even farther from that point than I am; and the fact that I especially right now do not want to put my wife and kids through what coming out would mean within my family and this small town; doing what I did where I did it was very stupid. As my wife put it last night, at least I could have been fully dressed. And plus I went against two agreements with my wife. No surprises and only in public in male or female mode.

It is one of those things that a person looks back and really thinks what was I thinking? .... was I thinking?

I took a trip to my counselor, which is fairly safe being it was at 7pm when there is normally 1 to none in the waiting room and my counselor and the gal in the office are normally the only ones left except maybe for another counselor or two finishing some things up for the day. I had thought that through over and over and the safety factor was good. I would even have extra clothes along in case I got there and the parking was packed or there were lots of people there when I stuck my nose in.

What I did not think through enough was the last minute additional stop just before. My mind was alread at the point of being dressed and took the minimum steps to continue the process; no skirt, unisex top, and no enhancers.

So I am working on reprogramming my core logic memmory to treat each stop seperatly.

A work in progress,

KimberlyS - CD

[KimberlyS]

DonnaT,
thank you for your reply. I understand the do not want to be limited part, but my wife has also asked to no surprises and to talk to her first about things I want to do. And our communication has gotten so much better between us. And yes it does still need alot of work and much of that from my side. I guess it is like I tell my son when he says he can not do something. " I need some more practice" and maybe in my case I need alot more practice. Like my wife said last night, I can call her and bug her about other things. It was not like I could not have called.

I did not have an answer, other than my brain some how had the night off.

It is just so hard for me when I am the one hurting the ones I love. As that is not at all what I want to do. I often have wondered why our male protection of family does not kick in to protect our family at all costs like it does other times. Like the times I have stepped in front of my wife or kids to protect them from something. Or when someone says something about one of my family and I am right there to defend or protect them. My list is getting so long, I just hope I hope has time to answer all of them.

Marriage and relationships may not be always easy, but those that have two that think is is worth it will make it through it and become stronger and better. Our relationship is so much better and stronger today than it ever has been. I just hope we can continue to make it through the things in life together. And if I would quit messing up the works it would go alot easier.

My wife just called and tonight is date night. So the kids will be staying home and my wife and I will be having dinner out somewhere and hopefully some good bonding and quality time together. It has been awhile and note to self: "We need to do it more often".

KimberlyS-CD

[Kaye(SO)]

communicate and compromise but never cower

CJ, I am curious as to what you mean by cower?

kaye(so)

[KimberlyS]

Kira wrote me asking the following questions. And I though it would be an advantage to post them here also.

Kira, sorry for me confusing you. Let me try help.

Kira wrote: "Are you saying that you are stupid for going out in public because you live in such a small town or just because you feel the need to go out period?"

I am stupid for a couple of reasons here:
- Both my wife and myself agree that I do not want to out myself at this point in our lives and if ever.
- I told my wife "until such time as I can go to the hardware store in an old jean skirt, casual top, steel toe work boots, a two day beard, no makeup or wig; and be accepted in our little town of 3000, I would only leave the house/hotel presenting a male or female that society could accept"
- My wife asked for no surprises, but to talk with her first.
- While I did this in a larger town than what we live in, this was the town I grew up in and know lots of people there and they know me. And we often run into people we know when out shopping.
So along with going against agreed limits and other conversations and having a higher than needed potential for outing myself, that is why I was stupid. Like I told my wife I was not thinking right. A blonde moment if you would.

Kira wrote: "Are you wishing that you did not dress, or are you wishing that you could control the times you do? "

I wish that I would have thought the beginning of my outing, in that mode out, as well as I had thought out the going to my counselor part. Then I would have only done the going to counselor part and that I would have called my wife and let her know that I was doing it.

Kira wrote: "are you saying that you have a compulsion to dress half-and-half (partly as a woman and the other half male) and feel the need to go out"

I dress in multiple different modes given my mood and the amount of time I have to dress and the location I will be dressing. Examples include:
- under dressing, wearing panty or other items.
- wearing feminine clothes while at home and the kids are not around. Optional lipstick and jewelry.
- wearing uni-sex clothing out and about.
- full femme including makeup, wig and jewelry. Seldom done at home or hotel, and always except this once, if I am out and about.

And no matter what mode I am dressed as, I always feel like I am my male self. I do not feel girly or like a woman. I do not feel more feminine when fully dressed enfemme over being dressed fully male. For me personally I feel that the wig and makeup is just a mask that allows me to get out in society the way that I would like to be dressed at times.

In my perfect world I would get up in the morning and decide if I was going to be dressed more masculine, or more feminine, or more mixed, all according to my morning mood. And I would also choose my clothes by selecting something appropriate for what I was doing for the day. I would wear little to no makeup and always my own hair. And I would always be presenting my male self, just some days I would be more feminine and others more masculine.

But in reality I am married to a wonderful wife who is working through the issues with me to find where my CDing fits within our marriage. I have a job that I like and we have middle aged kids along with living in a small conservative town. Being part of a family and in a marriage or relationship takes communication and compromise to make things work for everyone. I personally do not want to give up what I have and should be enjoying. I do have a wonderful life, I / we just need to figure out where this CDing fits in that is acceptable to all of us.

KimberlyS - CD

[Jeannie]

I 've been reading these posts and kept quiet because when I open my mouth I usually put my foot in it! You ladies know!LOL This just my take on people like us.
Since coming out in the last few months I realize I should of done it long ago. Im so much happier now even though some others in my life are not. I dress as a man and a woman when I feel like it. I can't pass as a woman but I don't care and you'll find most others don't care either.
I was at my Daughter Katie's apartment tonight in West Hartford Conecticut and made dinner for her and her girlfriend Alissa. She lives on the first floor of a five story apartment building. I went out back in my red sun dress,make up ankle bracelets and my comfy clogs to have a cigar. There were two guys out there grilling and I went over and introduced myself as Jeannie and told them my daughter katie lives here. They didn't bat an eye. We started talking and they said"Jeannie. We're going down to Tisanes. It's a bar about two blocks down the street. Tuesday night is Gay and Transgendered night. Would you like to come with your daughter?" They were both gay. I said I have to go back to Waterbury and cook for my other kids but I'll be here next tuesday!.
My daughter and her friend Alissa have a date with me next tuesday at Tisanes. You have to be yourself. If you're with someone who can't accept you and never will move on. You will make both of you miserable. The best thing I've ever done in my life is being myself. You will find your way and meet the people who will be your friends and not those that will only be your handlers. Telling you how you have to live your life to make them feel comfortable. Compromise? I think not. Control is more like it. If you live in a unforgiving town move. If you live with an unforgiving partner show them the door. You are better off alone and being yourself. You will not be alone for long. Trust me. You will find others who accept you from the get go. No BS. No heavy duty discussions just "Hey what's happening! What are doing tonight?" Life is choices. Good ones and bad ones. I made mine and it was the good one. I'm happy. Are you?


Love
Jeannie

[Rose Darn]

Donna,

Hopefully I won't push too hard and find myself freer than intended.

I could not agree more, with most all you said.
rose