Crossdressers-Haven.com

I see it has been all of 3 weeks since I told myself no more dressing. I haven't been too sucessful at being all guy. Feeling like part of me is made of rubber and I'm squessing it into a corner. My wife says she won't leave me nomatter what but I can't shake the feeling that I'm letting her down. I wish I could go back into the closet and un-tell her. I hate to sound so negetive but coming out and losing that sealed off part of my life has not worked well for me. I'm dressing when she is out of the house and not telling her, she also hasn't asked me directly if I'm still doing it.
Question-- She does ask me " how are you doing ?" alot. Is she asking "are you crossdressing?" Should I tell I haven't found the "cure" yet?
We went to her Cristian theraphist, She said I need to find God and I'll been cured. I walked out shaking my head. The first theraphist I went to alone is secular(sp) and gay, not someone my wife can relate to.
This is getting long and I need to get into guy cloths now. As always Thanks for being here.

Hi Jill--
It's one of my biases, but I always feel that if it's at all possible, a CD needs to tell their wife. I know that my mental and physical health have always suffered when I felt I had to withhold information from people, and I'm generally in very good health.

So I can't help but feel that everyone experiences some of the effects of this, whether they feel it or not. That may or may not be true, but it has influenced my advice to others, certainly. So I for one did support your decision to tell your wife, even though the immediate here.now pain makes it seems like a difficult choice to live with.

I'm sorry to hear you're going through such distress. I know of no one who is able to stop displaying their female side completely, so I'm not surprised you're not able to either. I don't say it never happens--I can only say that in all my contacts over the last six years, I have not found anyone who quit.

It is unfortunate that this makes CDing look like an addiction or a compulsion. While it does have some characteristics of both of these, I can't equate it to drugs, alcohol, gambling, and other negatives. I know other people have negative feelings about what we do, and it may end up causing them some emotional pain. But unlike other compulsions, CDing is not harming others directly. It is not physically or emotionally damaging to us, either.

Let me be more specific. I think when there's negative feelings for us, it's the guilt and shame that are causing us the distress. I don't think it's neccesarily the CDing itself.

It may seem like a negative thing to people looking at it from the outside, but there are positive feelings that go with expressing a femme self. They may be different for each person, but it is very hard to give up something that has strong positive feelings. It's unfortunate that so much guilt and shame get piled in on top of these positive feelings, but they are there. I have seen many of us uncover them over the years, so I know that it can be done.

It is also a shame that it's the fulltime gals who do the most convincing job of this "uncovering", because it's easy to dismiss their viewpoint. "I'm just a CD--I can't go as far as they did." Well, that's true, but I think it is possible to
reap the benefits of their self-discovery, without having to go to extremes.

Maybe the gay therapist wasn't the answer for your wife, but neither is her counselor the answer for you. My only affirmation in these situations is one I've written on here before: "I want only what is best for ALL CONCERNED." That means you, her, relatives, friends--the whole big picture. I do not have the wisdom to see what's best in the short run, at all, because the pain in the short run is often too overwhelming. I do believe there is help available in the universe, but you have to get out of the way and let it work for you. My thoughts are with you!

Jill S wrote: Question-- She does ask me " how are you doing ?" alot. Is she asking "are you crossdressing?" Should I tell I haven't found the "cure" yet?

Tell her the truth.

Tell her all this talk of a "cure" is putting tons of stress on you. That you'd like for it all to go away, but that this fighting this part of yourself is having a bad affect on your health and peace of mind. That God made you the way you are, and that trying to deny this part of you is like denying God's wisdom. That He made you this way for a purpose, and you'd rather determine what that purpose is.

Jill S wrote: We went to her Cristian therapist, She said I need to find God and I'll been cured. I walked out shaking my head.

Jill, oh how I feel your pain and confusion on this one. I went through the same thing with a christian based therapist. As a part of the why are we there intro with this counselor my wife ask is there anything in the bible against crossdressing and he would not answer the question directly But I kept restating my question for the therapist until I got an answer and then continued to press for proof until I got the right answer. There is no where in the bible that says anything against crossdressing for gender identity reasons. If they think there is have them show you the spot. They can not. And the only place males wearing female clothes is mentioned is on the passage I believe in Deut., and make sure the whole passage is read as it is talking about other things, it is not about CDing. I love it when people only quote parts of passages in the bible to make there points in some things. Doing so can take the meaning so far out of context.

I was able to finally pin this therapist down to that cding was wrong only by current society thoughts and there is no where in the bible that says anything against crossdressing, and all three christian counselors I have seen have made the same similar statement. It is the other things that many people tack on to cders that is wrong. Such as affairs out side the marriage, hiding things from your spouse, deception, homosexuality and others. And the deception one is not even valid if you are cding for gender identity reasons, as the CDing is just part of who you are. And so many people change their looks in this world. Are they all deceiving the world via their use of makeup, hair color, shaving, plastic surgery, hair pieces, and many other ways.

Note: I am not stating personally that homosexuality is wrong, just that is what the therapist said. Christianity and homosexuality is a separate, and very hot topic.

As for how you answer the question from your wife: " how are you doing ?" This is a great opening for you to say, no I have not been CDing, but that you are struggling. And then explain how you are struggling and how you are feeling including why if you know. To make things better and work within relationships it takes communication both ways between spouses.

One thing I did to help my wife understand is I wrote down for her what a day was like for me including what I did, where I went, who/what I seen, my thoughts and how different things made me feel. As an example one part was just me walking home from work, how I felt as I walked home, as I met or seen people, what were my thoughts/though process. For me I notice people, guys and gals. But when seeing them I usually notice their appearance / clothes first well before noticing the person including often doing a gender typing prior to seen the face. As far back as I can remember I have done this. I think this allowed my wife to see more that is is part of me and who I am and not just something I do.

Good Luck and keep the communication flowing with your wife.

KimberlyS-CD

I guess I am asking alot for just over a month out to her. Looking back I think I have been useing " the I'm going to quite" thing more to keep from talking to her about my being TV, CD or whatever I am. Hopefuly we both get more use to this thing as time goes on. Maybe time for talk # 2?

I think I have been useing " the I'm going to quite" thing more to keep from talking to her about my being TV, CD or whatever I am.

That makes sense to me, and I know that I have done that. I bring up some painful subject to another person, and we hash it out. I have a lot more talking and feeling that I need to do about it, but I can see that they DON'T want to talk/feel about it. So I go back and try to solve it all on my own, just like I was doing before we talked about it.

It is sometimes harder to have that second talk, because the resistance has settled in. All you can do is take it a step at a time. Even if you don't immediately find out what SHE'S feeling, you can still talk about the rough time you've been going through.

Hi all,

Jill wrote: [My wife's Christian therapist] said I need to find God and I'll been cured.

Tell your wife's therapist that you found God here:

From Psalm 139 (NIV)


13 For you created my inmost being;
you knit me together in my mother's womb.

14 I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made;
your works are wonderful,
I know that full well.

15 My frame was not hidden from you
when I was made in the secret place.
When I was woven together in the depths of the earth,

16 your eyes saw my unformed body.
All the days ordained for me
were written in your book
before one of them came to be.

If God knows you and loves you and accepts you as you are, it matters little if therapists do not. The problem is not the CD'ing, it's the shame that holds you in its grip; shame, however, is imposed from without... not from within. Eleanor Roosevelt: "No one can make you feel inferior without your consent."

Love,
CJ

CJ, That is great. I have a therapist for you to talk with. One I live by, and you do not need to be a christian, as I believe it is more of a human moral is, " LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF"

Interestingly, I was going to give a location of this in the bible for those that are interested so I did a search on bible.com and just the top ten results were:

# 1 Leviticus 19:18 ,' [Deut 32:35; Rom 12:19; Heb 10:30] You shall not take vengeance, [Ps 103:9] nor bear any grudge against the sons of your people, but [Matt 19:19; Mark 12:31; Luke 10:27; Rom 13:9; Gal 5:14; James 2:8] you shall love your neighbor as yourself; I am the LORD.

# 2 Kings 4:3 ,Then he said, "Go, borrow vessels at large for yourself from all your neighbors, even empty vessels; do not get a few.

# 3 Proverbs 6:3 , Do this then, my son, and deliver yourself;Since you have come into the hand of your neighbor,Go, humble yourself, and importune your neighbor.

# 4 Matthew 19:19 , [Ex 20:12; Deut 5:16] HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER; and [Lev 19:18] YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF."

# 5 Matthew 22:39 , "The second is like it, ' [Lev 19:18; Matt 19:19; Gal 5:14] YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.'

# 6 Mark 12:31 , "The second is this, ' [Lev 19:18] YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.' There is no other commandment greater than these."

# 7 Luke 10:27 , And he answered, " [Deut 6:5; Lev 19:18] YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR STRENGTH, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND; AND YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF."

# 8 Romans 13:9, For this, " [Ex 20:13-ff; Deut 5:17-ff] YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, YOU SHALL NOT MURDER, YOU SHALL NOT STEAL, YOU SHALL NOT COVET," and if there is any other commandment, it is summed up in this saying, " [Lev 19:18; Matt 19:19] YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF."

# 9 Galatians 5:14 , For [Matt 7:12; 22:40; Rom 13:8, 10; Gal 6:2] the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, " [Lev 19:18; Matt 19:19; John 13:34] YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF."

# 10 James 2:8 , If, however, you [Matt 7:12] are fulfilling the royal law according to the Scripture, " [Lev 19:18] YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF," you are doing well.

I have been on long road trips for work the last few days. Lots of time to think and work things out. I believe I have come to the point were I won't repress(sp?) this any longer. Repession and guilt hurt and haven't made me stop. I know many of you have been at peace with "this thing" for along time, for me it's all so new. I have been discreet enough to hide it from my wife for over 20 years, so keeping it out of her sight should be doable. She's told be she has no desire to see me dressed. I can understand her feeling this way. Just wanted to do an update. I will be driving all over the state for the next week or so, and won't near the computer. Hope the hoilidays are restfull and bring joy to all of you.

Somewhat at peace, Jill

Remember, deception was your enemy here. You couldn't quit because you were decieving yourself... but when you decieve your wife like this, it will be quite a bit worse if she finds out that you're still doing it and that you've been lying to her the entire time. It's good that you chose to keep with it, but be tactful with your next move...

I knew a woman once who was a minister and who did faith healing. She would pray over you and ask God to intercede to heal what ever was wrong. Many people found her very helful.

Here's the thing. She was on crutches for the rest of her life. Her legs had some sort of problem which left her unable to walk without crutches.

She talked about this often. Specifically how God had healed her, not her legs. And so she was grateful to God for the crutches which allowed her to work and most of the time pretty much at peace with her need to use them.

You may want to consider crossdressing and God in this light.

It sounds like you and your wife are very in touch with your love for each other and trying very hard to be accepting of aspects of the other that don't quite mesh with your own needs. I would think that if you remember this and keep this the focus then what you choose to wear and when you wear it will be a situation that you will eventually learn to assign the proper importance. Something that is perhaps, perhaps not, neccesary for you but not defining of who and what you are. Something that may remain private but not secret.

Easy for me to talk, I know. I haven't told my wife that much. What I have told her leads me to think she might not want to be told. At least that's what the folks in f2f who know us both who I have told think.
Absaroka