femmed and punished

[Anne-Marie]

My upbringing has been completely non-Christian and secular but still as a 13-14 year old I had the fantasy of being forced to wear female clothes, do household work that usually my sisters did and then caned on the bottom with skirt up for not doing the work as well as they did. So I don't think that Catholic upbringing per se elicits CD desires. These desires appear to be prevalent in all cultures and at all times in history. The theme of crossdressing is present in many ancient myths/stories and, coming nearer to our time, in many of Shakespeare's plays for example.

[Frances Jewell]

The Nuns and I just never got along. They kept wanting to stifle my literary talents. In college it was the Priests. Now, I just leave out the middleman and deal directly with heaven.

Fran

[Erin L]

LOL Frances.

It was only with many years of restrospection that I realized that I probably traumatized the nuns at least as much as they did me.

[CherryLynn]

Frances
I gave up on the Catholic church years ago- still religious in my own way.

[EmilyN]

i can't imagine that i would be the ideal candidate for someone who was interested in forcing a man to crossdress as a woman. i suspect someone who wanted to force that on another would do so in hopes of encountering reluctance, shame and fear. i, on the other hand, would be willing, eager, and delighted.

i can just hear the complaint now..."no, silly, you're supposed to complain and say things like 'must i?' and 'oh no, anything but that!'.....not 'oh goodie, please zip me up!' and 'do you think i should go with black accessories or stay in the same color palette?'

[Erin L]

Emily, all I can say is that the dilemma for me was to try to get "punished" without making it obvious that I wanted to be. Never figured it out, though.

[Merinda]

I went to state public schools in my younger days , I had a number of very dominent female teachers for various subjects .
I had absolutly no interest in dressing at that stage of my life and would have totally rejected the idea , growing my hair long was the first thing that influenced me when I started to look like a girl . I was secretly happy to be mistaken for a girl but still rejected the idea of dressing until the age of about 25 / 26 , at that stage there were only dominent males in my life.

[Anne Bonny]

I do not know where this desire comes from, I only know that I identify in some way with women, I want to look like and be encouraged and accepted as female or feminine. I was never forced, I seem to have been predisposed. I feel it is in some way bound to my sexuality - I cannot help it, I cannot change it, an alloy for loss of words, part of my spirit, a yearning inside. I am who I am I cannot help who I am, I just accept it. I love who I am, and wish I was pretty and could freely dress with the full acceptance of society just as GG's do.

[Azurielle]

I went to a catholic school for my first three grades, but then I got expelled for strangling the nun with a rope after she smacked my knuckes until they bled for spilling something (I think it was acrylic paint) on her dress. Nevertheless, the public system rocked and that school was closed down seven years ago due to lack of pupils. I still often get aggressive when people want to bring back corporal punishment in schools.

I still have scars on my left hand from that perticular incident.

Nonetheless, I would have had horrible behavior if petticoat punishment was applied. I was always the teacher's pet, but the prospect of frilly dresses would've turned me into one little devil .

[JoAnnDallas]

I'm not surprised at all the horror stories that come from the Catholic Church. When you consider all the horror stories that have come out about Pedophile Priests and Monks and that the church ran sweat shops in Ireland using child labor.

[Erin L]

Actually, the incidence of pedophile priests is statistically no more than in the rest of the population. That is, there is an equal percentage of pedophile soccer coaches, pedophile teachers, etc. It doesn't seem that way because of the way that stories of priests get played up.

I had my fair share of horrible experiences growing up in parochial elementary school. Parochial high school was a different story, but that's just my experience. I've come to the conclusion that the Catholic Church, like any other human institution, is inherently flawed because human beings are inherently flawed. As St. Augustine said, man is weak willed, with a darkened intellect and a marked propensity to do evil.

Countless horrific acts have been committed in the name of various religions. Islam has come to be identified with terrorism; the Israelis have for years engaged in counter-terrorism. Turning away from religion altogether fares us no better - an avowed athiest regime gave us the gulag.

In the end, I think Pogo said it best: "We have met the enemy, and he is us."

[Lydia]

Years ago, Phillip Wylie wrote a fascinating novel called "The Disappearance", in which there were two parallel worlds - one with all women and the other all men. Great story.

Hugs,

Lydia

[KimberlyS]

Erin, the big thing about the pedophiles in the Catholic Church that makes me mad and many others that I have talk to about the subject, is the way the Church protects them. And I am not going to say any more as I do not want to moved this the hot topics.

[CJ]

Hi all,

An aside to Lydia:

Wylie's The Disappearance is a great story, indeed. But, just to set the record straight, it's not about two parallel worlds, but about a single world where the simultaneous disappearance of men from the world of women and of women from the world of men result in a split reality. Yes, this leads to two parallel worlds but it's important to state that these two worlds were once one... or else all the drama is leached out of any scene where a man must learn to do the laundry and a woman to fix a leaking roof.

As to the subject at hand:

One theory I've heard floating around out there regarding forced feminization or petticoat punishment (or call it what you will) is that, on the one hand, male submission to a woman in a position of power or authority coupled with, on the other, the forced feminization of this male, serve as a subconscious and socially acceptable way for (traditionally) socially and sexually powerful males to relinquish some of that power in order that they may release some of the stress and anxiety that usually accompany it.

"I don't want this; she forced me, she made me do it." This need for such feminized males to deny their submissive desires--desires that, if brought fully into consciousness, would be unacceptable in the threat they would represent to the social and sexual power, to the very manhood, of these males--is, in essence, a "face-saving" psychological mechanism. It operates under the radar. Thus (a feminist would say), men win again in these forced feminization scenarios; not because womanhood and femininity are sullied by the implication that they're somehow socially or sexually inferior (although there IS that) but, rather, because, in such scenarios, men again bend women to their own ends and desires and get away with it scot-free by pretending that they, the men, are non-consenting victims in the whole situation.

Moreover, were a submissive male to be partnered to, or subjugated by, a truly authoritarian and dominant woman, this would in no way alter the premise that this male is the one who basically remains in control throughout the whole situation--be he "forced-feminized" or not. If this weren't the case, there'd be no need for safe words.

Hey, folks, don't get me wrong; I, myself, have had, and still have, such fantasies. My problem is that, in my case, their foundations no longer operate under the radar. This makes me question the legitimacy of my own submissive desires. Am I then some kind of closet male chauvinist rather than the balanced feminist I've always believed myself to be? I don't know. I've yet to settle that question for myself to my own satisfaction. But, true to myself, I'm still searching.

The whole "religious setting" issue (fierce nuns and all that jazz... and they don't call Mother Superior "superior" for no reason, I'm sure) has only to do, I think, with the fact that such authoritarian women as are the subjects of male forced feminization fantasies must also be, uh, endowed (if you will), with the capacity to deliver corporal punishment. Nuns do it (or did). Teachers do it (or did). Family members (or legal guardians) do it (or did). And, in the world of sexual fantasy, bosses, nurses, roommates, stilletoed aristocrats, landlords, neighbours, and a myriad ilks of sexy matrons do it (and will always do it). Ah, but reality is otherwise. Hence the existence of the dominatrix. (Funny that we never call the male counterpart of the dominatrix a "dominator"... what would be the point? In this world or society or culture, his being male makes him, by definition, a dominator.)

Yes, the idea of being "femmed and punished" has been around for a long time. It's a hoary concept. Enthralling to many crossdressers, but hoary nonetheless.

Now I better stop this before the cane comes out.

Love,
CJ

[Erin L]

Erin, the big thing about the pedophiles in the Catholic Church that makes me mad and many others that I have talk to about the subject, is the way the Church protects them.

I don't disagree with that at all. Although that, too, has finally started to change.