kinky side

Carolynn · Post by **Carolynn** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 1:08 pm

Blanchard, Zucker and company who are rewriting the DSM version 5 say that most of what have been considered sexual perversions are in fact sexual disorders and need psychiatric treatment. He classes them as a paraphilia along with paedophilia, fetishistic transvestism (which most psychologist presently class S&M in part), crossdressing and other forms of autogynophilia.

I hope for all of our sakes that there will be a thorough hashing out and rejection of their stance on most of these things, as once diagnosed, you may have to have "treatment" to be considered fit parents or to be around children, or keep your "dirty little secret" even closer to your heart to avoid potential blackmail or being fired from jobs if they involve children, or it becomes known and the higher ups in the company feel "you do not meet the image we wish to project for our company/school or what have you.

Wendae · Post by **Wendae** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 1:22 pm

That's terrible!

Carolynn · Post by **Carolynn** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 1:49 pm

Blanchard claims that the new DSM-V will reflect his and Zucker's view that all sexual games are paraphilias along with paedophilia and autogynophilia, and are sexual disorders. A diagnosis of this will follow you throughout your lives, as having a mental disorder. He already considers gays and transsexuals as being mentally disordered with a type of autogynophilia.

See the post in transgender issues for more.

Wendae · Post by **Wendae** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:02 pm

Oh well, lead me to the rubber room. Oh, I forgot that would be inkeeping with one of my mental disorders! Seriously tho, that does not bode well. Back into the deep dark closet...

Carolynn · Post by **Carolynn** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 8:14 pm

Before Doom and Gloom, I think we need to wait and see the outcome of the APA meetings with three sessions on the subject. A lot of pros are very critical of Zucker/Blanchard/Bailey/Lawrence/Dreger approach. It just seems like the bad guys have the bit in their teeth right now.

The new DSM has to be approved by the entire committee.

Carolynn

Post by **KimberlyS** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 9:11 pm

To me it sounds like there are two guys who are fighting their kinky side. Can we say thou does fight it too much. Or they need to get one.

Carolynn · Post by **Carolynn** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 11:06 pm

I have a simpler explanation. The are ego ridden, greedy, and are homo and trans phobic.
They are also eugenics champions, and believe we should have tests for people like us and terminate us before birth.

Wendae · Post by **Wendae** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 11:08 pm

Sorry! No more from me on the subject.

Merinda · Post by **Merinda** » Wed Apr 29, 2009 3:31 am

Carolynn wrote:Blanchard, Zucker and company who are rewriting the DSM version 5 say that most of what have been considered sexual perversions are in fact sexual disorders and need psychiatric treatment. He classes them as a paraphilia along with paedophilia, fetishistic transvestism (which most psychologist presently class S&M in part), crossdressing and other forms of autogynophilia.

paedophilia = sexual interest in pre-pubic childeren
autogynophilia = sexual self pleasuring

If Blanchard, Zucker cant tell the difference and they think these are in the same boat , then I suggest "THEY" may be the ones in need of psychiatric eveluation.

Robyn Katie · Post by **Robyn Katie** » Wed Apr 29, 2009 5:54 am

Hi sisters,

I strongly agree that Messrs Zucker, Blanchard et al are likely to be working out of their own repression.

Markedly similar to the "closet gay mafia" inner circle famed during the Bush administration for a quiet but steady barrage of homophobia.

The urge to suppress seems to grow right out of the urge to do. Like the cop who turns criminal, etc. etc.

How to rein in the tendency of this sort of closet case to gravitate to, and abuse power, is a whole nother question. Now there's a challenge for a true democracy.

Love, Robyn Katie

Absaroka · Post by **Absaroka** » Wed Apr 29, 2009 7:16 am

S0me things ought just be extremely illegal, including stuff like child molesting, bestiality, necrophilia, and anything where one partner is not voluntary. Other than that what consenting adults do in private or in semin private consensual settings like clubs ought be nobodies business. Likewise I think prostitution should be legal although I personally have no desire to pay someone to have sex with me.

Invariably someone will bring up issues like disease, exploitation, or shame. Sure prostitutes get exploited, just like poor people get exploited in every other way. Issues like this and also issues like disease can be far better addresses if things are legal and not either a crime or a reason for diagnosis.

As for stuff like BDSM or role playing, I think the key word here is play. Sex as play. Something that puritans who think it is a neccesary evil for procreation seem to have a lot of trouble with. Well they don't have to do it.

As for the mental health aspect, well one of my (several) diagnosis is atypical anxiety disorder. Among other things it means I worry a lot, feel anxious a lot, and sometimes get angry a lot. None of those things are illegal. However when they got to a point where they interfered with my life it was time to do something about them. I saw a shrink which was very helpful, and got a diagnosis, which was neccesary in order to get insurance to pay for it.

Lets face it, if your life is falling by the wayside because of your sexual desires you may have a problem. Most people with out of the ordinary desires manage to keep them in perspective, and thus do not need a diagnosis.

There is another issue here that is rarely addressed in this forum. Part of what we need to do is remove the stigma of having a psychiatric diagnosis in the first place. After all if I break my leg and have a diagnosis of acute muscular skeletal trauma there is no stigma. Why should occaisional mild emotional fractures be any different.

SOmetimes I'm physically ill. Sometimes I'm mentally ill. I have several DSM code numbers to prove it. So what!

Absaroka

Carolynn · Post by **Carolynn** » Wed Apr 29, 2009 9:01 am

You are correctt that obsessions that hurt innocents should be considered illegal. However, there are many things identified by people like Zucer and Blanchard that are MORAL issues with them. It has no place in psychiatry, except as the patient has conflict with his personal morality and his desires, or with adapting to a disapproving society.

Sadly enough, the entire society stigmatizes mental illness, though most draw some sort of lines in their consideration. Depression is so pervasive and people take pills for it, that it is a non starter. So long as something is diagnosed as a syndrome or neurosis, it is not an attention getter, just an eccentricty. But if the diagnosis is a Disorder, say goodbye to career advancement. The feeling seems to be that since you are "disordered" and therefore mentally ill, then you will be unable to handle more responsibility, and you may even be changed to lesser responsibility, for your own good, of course!

Many people diagnosed with GID have found this out the hard way and are even unemployed because of the diagnosis. It happens. So usually, using insurance is not a good idea because the diagnosis gets back to the workplace despite confidentiality between therapist and patient. The leak is the insurance documentation provided by the company to the employer.

If you are not diagnosed with a disorder, and do not use insurance, it is not on the radar if you are a cd unless you become open with your gender dysphoria for example. It is interesting to me that GID is one Disorder than can be cured with a 97% success rate by a medical procedure, but that is another rant.

The same applies to S&M. When you enjoy it and participate as a game, its your own personal source of fun. When it gets "serious" and begins impinging on your daily life and you start thinking about it a lot, then people start to notice. If you go to a psych, you may find yourself diagnosed with a disorder because it affects you in your day to day life rather than just situationally by your choice.

There is a difference between diagnosis and treatment. The info in the DSM is for diagnosis. Treatment is what you and your health care professional decide to do about what may at some point amount to a depressive obsession. Most prescribe calming medication and continued therapy. May not work terribly well, but that is what they have available.

Oh well.

Merinda · Post by **Merinda** » Wed Apr 29, 2009 3:11 pm

Robyn Katie wrote:Hi sisters,

I strongly agree that Messrs Zucker, Blanchard et al are likely to be working out of their own repression.

Markedly similar to the "closet gay mafia" inner circle famed during the Bush administration for a quiet but steady barrage of homophobia.

I agree ,

Its easy to push your own beliefs by finding some stupid argument and say its scientific fact.

To link Kinky sex or Autogynaphilia to child molestation is offensive.