why modes?

[Ralitsa]

So there is "girl mode" and "boy mode", but why? Is it necessary to be all "like a girl" or all "like a boy"?
I don't have any modes actually, just a wide range of variations. Sometimes (rarely) I'm wearing all guy stuff, but mostly it's womens stuff that could be mistaken for guy stuff, or a combination of "conservative" womens clothes with maybe some cute boots or a nice top. And then quite often I'm wearing a dress, with heels and pantyhose, but never really "passing". I almost always wear earrings (not a masculine style either) and always carry my purse, when it's obvious that I'm not a woman.
So everyone recognizes me regardless of how I'm dressed, I don't fool anyone and I don't try to. I'm wondering why many feel like they need to disguise themselves, or not to be recognized, or to be interpreted as a woman.

[Anita]

Hi Ralitsa--
Welcome to the forum!

The topic is covered in this particular thread, both in the original post and in the answers to it.

From the post:

"John had on a custom gray leather miniskirt, nice hose, and black heels. That’s the ‘gal half.’ Topside he had a light-colored shirt with a collar, and his trimmed moustache and male haircut. No forms, makeup, earrings—that’s not John’s style. So there’s no question of ‘passing’ when we’re out. It’s more about dignity, ease in being, and an ability for us to come up with one-liners when needed."

http://crossdressers-haven.com/forums/v ... ta+cruz%2A

In answer to your question, I personally prefer presenting all one gender or the other. People treat me differently when I'm dressed female, and most of the time, I like that difference. I don't even have to pass, but I have to be clearly female-appearing in order for people to make that switch in their minds.

So for me in particular, it's a strong incentive not to blend genders. In 49 years of male living, I never experienced anything close to what I get from presenting a version of a woman. If I'm androgynous, that "difference" in people's responses is just not there, and I miss it.

[Kimberly Kael]

You're absolutely right that there's a continuum of appearance and behavior that is open to exploration, with no "good" reason why it has to be one way or another. The challenge is that the gender binary is pretty deeply rooted in our society, as illustrated clearly by our language.

We've been taught to identify gender at a glance and then use that knowledge in our choice of pronouns and other gendered language, so it's downright disconcerting to many people when they can't categorize you. They get uncomfortable and are likely to turn take out their frustration on its source.

It isn't fair, but it is pretty consistent. There are certainly gender warriors who enjoy making people aware of their preconceptions by violating them. More power to them, certainly, but I'm happy enough presenting an image that is comfortably feminine. In the long run perhaps gender-neutral language will be more widely adopted but it's not the kind of change that happens overnight.

[SilverLady(SO)]

Hi, Ralitsa, and welcome to the Forum!

In answer to your query, my opinion is that if one wants to present as female, or male, then it's all or nothing. I realize that not every CD or TG will be able to 'pass' completely, but they should at least attempt to pass . . . enough so that anyone else is at least asking "that was a lady, right?" or something similar.

I realize that mine is not a popular opinion among some at this forum, and that is fine. I do not want to see the proverbial bearded lady, and I will not be seen in public around someone in that mode of dress . . . regardless of how well I like them. If anyone is going to 'walk the walk' then they had better look and dress the part, too (no "people of WalMart", thank you very much).

If one does not hold themselves to a higher standard, then they'll never be thought of on a higher level by others, either.

- SL

[Kimberly Kael]

If one does not hold themselves to a higher standard, then they'll never be thought of on a higher level by others, either.

If you're going to draw lines of acceptable behavior, why not just insist that everyone stick with the gender they were assigned at birth? It's not like I don't understand what you're saying, I just think it's hard to justify throwing stones. What is clear is that presenting in a way that makes other people uncomfortable is an extremely hard road to travel.

... but the fact that transgender folk see an increasing level of acceptance can be attributed to a few who chose to walk that long, hard, lonely road and show others that they were still decent people. I hesitate to condemn anyone who feels the need to be themselves. I just think they need to know how difficult it's likely to make their lives. It takes generations, not just a few hard years, to make progress against societally bias.

[SilverLady(SO)]

Kimberly -

I was not throwing any stones.

You have chosen to interpret my statements with thoughts I never had. My statements are very clear and there are never any hidden meanings in what I say, think or do.


I stand by what I wrote.


- SL

[Carol Ann]

Well for me from day one after my mother came to grips with it as she told me " if your going to dress like a girl it's all the way and proper".
My wife also from day one has said " dress proper and dress your age",

So for me it's all the way when I dress and pass as a women, I guess to tell the truth I don't know any other way.

[Ralitsa]

So are you not reinforcing the stereotypes with the "all or nothing" approach? Are you not really just saying "only women can wear dresses, so if I wear a dress I need to make people think I'm a woman"?
If it's really ok for men to wear "women" clothes, then why hide the fact that a man is wearing "womens" clothes?
The behaviour is not consistent with the protestations.

[Tara M]

What's the point in wearing femme stuff that looks like male clothing?

[DonnaT]

Hi Ralitsa, to the forum.

In my opinion, restricting one's mode of dress to all boy or all girl plays to the social idea of male or female, nothing in between. The gender binary.

Society needs to get over it. There are trans people who don't fit the binary, and there are Intersex people who don't fit the binary.

I'll never understand why society needs to restrict what we wear, based on the gender binary.

They got over women wearing pants, surely they can get over men wearing skirts/dresses.

[Absaroka]

Ralitsa it's a good question and I'm glad you posted it. As you can see there is quite a variety of opinion here.

I'd agree with Kimberly that part of the question is about presenting in a way that makes people comfortable, or not.

One of the issues that sometimes comes up here is the question of the transexual, in this forum almost always MTF, who may be transistioning but doesn't dress in anything but sloppy jeans and tees. That seems to offend some folks, mostly the folks who don't like women to dress overly casual in public. Hence the dichotomy of male/ female vs well dressed/slovenly vs clearly one gender/genderbending. Consensus is unlikely.......

[Anne]

I have my fem glam then I have my fem neutral items. While one ideal would be to pass in ultrafem, to contemplate going out in other circumstances may require either fem gender neutral or fem boy looking items.

I wouldn't want to be thought different for any of the presentations. As they are not genderbending like the skirt and beard, I don't see issues other than a different mindset

[Bernice]

Hi Ralitsa; Welcome to the forum.

You asked a very good question. I don't have a good answer. It shouldn't matter, but if I'm honest, it does.

I agree with Carol Ann.

Still, I recognize the myth of the binary gender, and I also agree with my dear SO, who say's "It's just clothing!"

So, at least I can now feel guilty for agreeing with Carol Ann.

Gender-benders still sometimes make me a little uneasy. Even when I know my attitude is the one that needs an adjustment, it can be hard to adjust.

Hugs,

Bernice

[Paula G]

"Gender benders can sometimes make me uneasy" - I have found that to be a normal reponse, I had for some time told myself that I was simply a man who liked to wear womens clothes, therefore why should I try to look like a woman, when I was clearly a man. Sorry but I was the bearded man in a dress (or more likely a skirt and top). Gradualy I started to add a little make up and made a more and more feminine presentation, it was only when I saw a photo of myself fully made up but still with the beard and some chest hair showing that I realised how ridiculous I looked, and why I attracted so much attention. How sales staff kept straight faces I don't know!

About a month ago I shaved my beard off, and reduced other visable hair and have tried to improve my presentation, people around me when I go out are much more comfortable, therefore so am I, this means that my interaction with others is much more genuine and enjoyable. I may not be passing but even so others will relate to me as a woman, or at least choose to relate to me as a woman rather than some kind of freak they don't know whether to laugh at or run away from.

If CDs are so keen to pass why do we make it so easy to be spotted, four inch heels and leather miniskirt - in the supermarket!

[CJ]

Hi all,

Welcome aboard, Ralitsa.

Your question reminds of the title of one of Kate Bornstein's books: Gender Outlaw: On Men, Women, and the Rest of Us

Being in "boy mode" or in "girl mode" is usually about being men or women whereas, quite often, being transgendered is about belonging to Bornstein's "rest of us." Obviously, I'm not saying that transsexuals and fully passing crossdressers (of whatever sex and gender) cannot also be considered "gender outlaws" (i.e., transgendered) but only that those who eschew conforming to, or who don't expect others to conform to, the gender binary stand in the margins. Yet, as one of my clients is fond of saying, even the margin is on the page.

It looks to me as though there are at least two schools of thought on this issue: you can, as a transgendered person, move from one (uncomfortable) gender to the opposite (and more comfortable) gender or you can choose to simply do away with hoary either/or notions of gender altogether in your own life. As Kimberly has already pointed out, though, opting for the latter stands to get you some flak from a mainstream culture where groupthink often has it that bearded ladies belong in a circus.

Personally, I'm not yet quite sure where I stand on the matter. When I crossdress fully, I like to at least try to pass for a woman (with mixed results, I'll admit) but, at the same time, I sort of long to live in a world where it ought not to matter how one dresses. I know that world is far off. I'm going to go out on a limb here and state that, if this world is, indeed, on the way, it's largely thanks to those transgender individuals who don't feel a pressing need to make others around them comfortable more than it is to those who try to camouflage the subterfuge (the subterfuge being that you're a man who people will believe is a woman or vice versa).

A hairy-legged, bearded man dressed in fine silk stockings, sheer undies, heels, swishy skirts, and gossamer blouses will, almost by default, force people to confront their own adherence to a binary gender system that, quite obviously, doesn't encompass everyone (Bornstein's "rest of us"). Conversely, a man fully decked out as a woman--even though he may not successfully pass--is (perhaps inadvertently) sending the message that he believes the binary gender is a legitimate framework. This puts those in the cisgendered mainstream more at ease. People will think, "okay, I get who or what this person is trying to be, and maybe he or she just needs to work a little more at it" whereas, in the case of the stocking- heels- and dress-wearing bearded dude, people will go, "WTF!!?!"

You'll find a spectrum of opinions (and occasional debate) about this subject on this forum, Ralitsa. I think all these voices contribute to the Great Conversation On Gender that is finally finding its way into the culture at large. Again, on a more personal level, I tend to be an individualist; I can do "boy mode" and I can do "girl mode" but, in the end, I see both as belonging to the realm of social performance. What really matters to me is that both these modes be subsumed, in my own life, under "self mode" (i.e., authentic selfhood mode). In other words, that I never forsake who I truly feel myself to be, as a person. And this is all I'll ever expect from others, as well, whether they choose to "stealthify" their transgenderedness by adhering to the binary or to flaunt their non-adherence to that same binary.

Just be who you are and let others worry about who they are. Do not overly worry about what others think of you. I really do believe this is the best road to happiness. And if you have the strength to be someone who radically differs from the norm, then all the more power to you. You are an agent and an engine of change.

Love,
CJ