What are the basics?

[Kelly]

So I go to an art museum I see beautiful paintings that just take my breath away. Appreciate each piece as I do, I am not capable of composing anything similar.

Likewise, as I see a stylish lady I marvel at the ensemble she is wearing; but alas while shopping I have yet to envision putting pieces of clothing and accessories together in an attractive way. About the best I can do is recognize a really cute, say, cardigan, but of all the rest on the rack telling which ones are ok and which ones are hideous - well the synapses just aren't firing.

I look at all the floor displays, I browse every catalog that comes through, I have even gone through Latanya's 'fashion likes' thread and read the comments.

The problem is that I have yet to figure out the basic rules. Other than don't mix vertical and horizontal lines, the method for composing an outfit is eluding me.

While doing the research is fun, the rate of progress is frustrating. Please help me figure this out.

Kelly

[Noeleena]

Hi .

Kelly .

What works on myself would nowt work for you, even though Im an Edwardian woman and dress in Renaissance times, wear our uniform for our brass band ,& then my normal day wear ,

I have so many different style's it comes down to height size and weight and the more importaint feature is my masculine facial features , so straight off i have the difference of it has to suit me,
or i look stupid, plain simple and looks right im loath to wear anything thats frilly or what my womens Edwardian women wear, or too feminine im just not so more a berufst'a'tige Frau = working woman,

Yet i could see lovely clothes that would suit Jos down to the ground & she would look lovely, and yes i would buy them for her, then id ask Jos if i saw something that i would like it was hmmm yes or. no way. dont worry i get things wrong so with what i have i know will be okay

Now the best i can do / say is go to a good clothes shop and ask, set your self a budget ,and ask a woman what suits you what will look nice on you your frame size and body shape look at your hair colour style and height shoes and makeup if you wear such.

The other detail second hand shops same again ask allso try them on what you may think looks lovely may not on you,so ask, youll get the idear ill say time again allways ask friends wife or any one who will give an honist answer,

Now i wont say what the basic's are as your hmmm oh dear what contry i know here New Zealand and Austraila, not over your way,
I dont follow fashon or trends im a non conformist though i dress nicely a rebel if you like

the basic for myself is skirts jean type and colour , black or brown shoes or angle boots good stout walking boots, or summer sandles tops tee open neck not revealing any colour jumpers as needed blouse's multy coloured or plain colour now pants ... ONLY ... for our band other wise ill be skirted up. with our dark colour of red for our jacket quite smart i like it im not a pants or tie person.

Many of my clothes are good qulity second hand between 3 to 10 $ and dont care if not fitting ill redo and sew them or remake them and make many of my clothes,

Not sure if i can get pics up id be quite happy to email them as that work's most times .

The best advice is have another woman with you, while buying clothes .

...noeleena...

[Anthony Simon]

I guess my basic rule is "keep it simple". I tend to stick to simple one coloured articles of clothing and try to match them together when I'm buying. Like if I've got a mauve top, I might be looking for a skirt in a related colour - maybe red or purple and a scarf also, say, in red or purple. Like then you've got an outfit with some contrast and some matching in it - but hopefully without any clashing.

If that's too boring, I could go for an item with some patterning in it, say a black and white scarf to add some visual interest. This leads to the whole business of "accessorizing".

When I'm in a charity shop, where the clothes are reasonably inexpensive, I'll often do that sort of stuff. Find one item I like and then attempt to find other stuff that will work with it and make an ensemble. Like I hold stuff out together to see if colours match etc..

I do also, now, have an internalized conception of my made-up face and hair. So I ask, mentally, if this is the sort of thing "she" would wear at the start.

[DonnaT]

Start with black, like a black skirt. It can be as long as you wish, or if you have the legs for it, relatively short.

Finding a blouse to wear with a black skirt is easy, since all colors go with with black. It can be a solid color, a patterned color, lacy, etc.

Hose can be black or suntan, sticking to basics.

Shoes should be black or may be similar in color to the blouse.

Purse can be black or similar in color to the shoes.

[Davita]

You can always wear what the maniquin is wearing in the store/department that fits you. If you buy a dress, all your matching is pretty much taken care of for you. If you want two pieces then hold both of them up to you at a mirror. If you like it you buy it or you can get the second opinon of the salesperson.

Trendy clothes are harder to pair up than the classics. But then again today's trendy pushes boundaries of matching don't they? Lastly, salesfolks are there to help you make a decision that makes you happy so you will like the store and return. If they are too far off and people, friends, family, strangers are making faces at you about the outfit, then you going back to that store are pretty slim.

[Kelly]

All good suggestions, thank you. Please, keep those suggestions and tips coming in!!!!!!!

Several are the "dho, I could have had a V8" variety. Keep it simple. Learn and internalize the color wheel. Start with something you like and incrementally build around it. Have an experienced 2nd opinion nearby ( a GG or an SA). I am not quite to the point of engaging the help of an SA, but getting closer each time I go shopping (or should I say browsing ).

Others the ok, I get it now variety.

I once heard 'black is a girls best friend' but it flew over my head. I get it now. If colors were blood types, then black is the universal donor. I assume you can flip it and start with a blank top? The only problem (for me, anyway) is to not end up looking goth.

Matching purse and shoes. Now I understand why women have almost as many purses as they do shoes!

I have been looking at what all the mannequins are wearing. A few issues, the mannequins are defiantly in a younger demographic than me; they are all wearing slacks; and they are all a lot skinnier. The slacks, I realize is the easiest issue to resolve; just find a skirt of the same color and fabric. Fine.

I guess I have to find places that cater to the 'more mature' woman. Macys, Nordstorms, sears, and JCP don't, or so it seems.

No matter how much I diet and exercise (and I am making progress in the battle of the budge) my rib cage isn't getting any smaller, and my shoulders are getting any less broad. I guess I need to find out where the 'full figure', or is it 'big boned', mannequins hang out . Oh, well.

I truly appreciate the comments so far. I may sound desperate and frustrated; maybe I am, to a degree. But, I am having fun along the way. At least I get to look at pretty things while I figure it all out. Having some concrete tools help.

Kelly.

[Ralitsa]

It's mostly about wearing color and styles that you like and that look good on you. There really aren't any "rules" as such. You just really need to go shopping more. If you go into a store thinking that you will buy A, B, and C according to the rule book and your tape measure, first of all it's not going to be much fun and second of all you will be wrong. Geez, stop thinking like such a guy!!

Go out, and try some things on, and have fun! You know, it's OK to ask for help if you're wearing a dress. Only men thing that they can never ask for help or have fun shopping. Shopping is not about getting all the ingredients like if you were following a recipe. Shopping is about seeing if the store has something that you like in your color and size, and then agonizing over the price when you find something you just love and have to have.

[Eileen (SO)]

Dear Kelly,

A good answer may depend on where you plan on going. Meeting friends for dinner? Going the local, very accepting bar? Casual out in public shopping like a lady because you can? Genetic women have been aware of things that go together from age 2. Like when guys look at a bolt and know which wrench to use and which way to turn it. Fashion sense is hard to explain, but when you get it wrong, you should be able to tell. Lord knows, plenty of women still have lots to learn. Like yoga pants, all the rage now. They only look good on fairly trim ladies. Larger women wearing them only makes their giant butt look bigger. Sorry, had to get that out. Meoww!

Some advice from my CD husband. Dresses never fit as well as like in the catalog, even on most women. Men's torso length makes most dresses look bad. Go with separates, mix and matching makes for more variety. Matching is your difficulty though. Stay with solid colored skirts, and subdued hues. Depending on what you would like to look like at the time, blouses come in so many styles and colors. Stay away from form fitting clothing or flashy colors. Remember, you are trying to blend in, not make a (poor) fashion statement.
When observing other women in public and what they wear, don't just look at the pretty ones. Observe the average, or less than average, they still look like women too!

My husband says he wants to pass in public as a homely woman, thankfully, he does better than that. Still, I cringe when the girlfriends go anywhere but a gay bar.

Eileen

[Kelly]

Ralitsa,

Ok, you nailed it. I'm busted (no pun intended).

You and Davita are really saying the same thing. Get help from the sales folk. Now, I am rationalizing shyness rather than guyness, to not asking for help. Doing it for the first time (and maybe the second, third, and forth) is the - I hope - the hardest. Maybe I am kidding myself.

I have been doing most of my shopping at Good Will and Value Village. I'm getting the message that I need to have more experience before flying solo and should instead go where there are eager salespeople ready and able to help.

Kelly

[Kelly]

Thank you, Eileen,

I is good to know that my opinion of larger women in yoga pants is shared.

Your comments help. Know the application. Never could find a dress that would 'feel right' so now I understand.

I too, just want to pass. I know I will never turn heads because I am gorgeous. I just don't want to turn heads because I am hideous.

I guess that trying to cram all of the understanding that a GG accumulates since age 2 into a couple of months of study and observation is an impossible undertaking. So I just have to get in the sandbox and play.

What starting this thread is that I saw in a re-sale shop the ultimate in matching. It was really stunning. As I stood there admiring it I thought how did anyone see to put all of these pieces together.

Thank,

Kel

[Martina Hall]

One of my GG friends told me not to wear spaghetti strap dresses, they are a dead giveaway. The bare-shouldered look is not good for most of us CDs. I went in search of a better look, and may have found it.

First, a A-line skirt that fits, not too short. ( Just above the knee ) It is a grey, not quite black. Then, I went in search of a business-suit like blazer that is the identical color. What luck. Found one.
These two items look like something a sexy lawyer might wear. Of course, I look overdressed if going to the grocery store, and it's a little hot during the warm half of the year, so the search for a good look continues. I seek advice from GGs, they seem to have a better eye for fashion mistakes than I do.
This "suit" cost less than five bucks, total. Any color shirt or blouse will go with dark grey, and they fit. Fit is very important. Happy shopping!

[Eileen (SO)]

I did forget to mention that resale shops like Goodwill or Salvation Army are great for shopping. I find yard work clothing there for myself and see plenty on men buying women's clothes. Most of my husband's wardrobe is from Goodwill. Even if something doesn't fit right, and he forgets to return it in time, it's only a few dollars loss.
Browsing through catalogs for larger women, observe the outfits modeled, including the jewelry and hair style. It's part of the total look being sold.
As Martina mentioned, stay away from bare shoulders, unless you're very petite in frame. More area to shave, dear. Yuk! I once was asked to help out in that regard. My response was to use Nair, become double jointed, or go get waxed. I can be supportive, up to the point of grooming my mate like a monkey.
Passing in public means no one notices you. A stunning outfit will draw more attention than you might want at the time.

Eileen

[Kelly]

I stop into the local Good Will shop about once a week. I am getting bolder each time. Today I actually bought something. My first purchase. It was a bra with a band size at what I think is the low end of what I will be ultimately be fitted.

When there I pay especially close attention to the shoes, but haven't found anything I like or fits.

I go through the rack of skirts and tops and that is where my eyes glaze over. The comments here have been helpful; but I haven't found anything that I like or fits.

To effectively shop at places like this you have to be patient and experienced. Patience I can handle. Experience is where I am lacking. I need some training wheels.

So, the other set of comments has been to leverage the help of SAs at local boutiques. I went into the local Dress Barn Women and actually let the SA help me. We found a skirt that went well with a top I liked and I tried them on. Didn't buy anything but did ask when they might go on sale. I was a positive experience - oh, that sounds so clinical, it was fun - and I'll be back. Just another baby step, I guess.

There is a Lane Bryant store near. Unfortunately, one of my daughters friends works there; so, if I shop there it is tantamount to coming out of the closet to the entire world. Not ready for that yet (if ever).

I have set up an email account for receiving notices about sales, coupons, and such. I have given them my birthday and can't wait to see what offers come in then.

I do notice that I am a bit more discerning when looking at the internet catalogs. Thanks due to the responses to my plea for help.

Making progress. Thanks to all.

Kelly.

[Ralitsa]

yes, I really don't like shopping from catalogs either, it's just too hard to guess whether it will fit right and look good. There are some things though, I've bought some swearter dresses that I really like that way, but of course they are thick and stretchy and cover a lot of sins.
And I confess, that I just like to look at and try on everything. It's just more fun that way.

[Tasi]

Hi Kelly - your frustration with finding clothes is the same for most women and the advice before me is all good. But what you need is a place to go where all this information is always available to you in an easy to read and easy to find format. That's Sister House (http://www.sisterhouse.net/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;) which is designed as a fashion site for crossdressers. Most of your answers are here and you can easily come back and reread any info that you missed the first time around. And there's lots of good stuff besides fashion. Our singular most popular article is How to Use the Restroom. My writers are all from within the community and known for their excellent fashion sense.

<* snip>

Just a word on catalogs and online shopping. Catalogs are good for looking at styles. Start yourself a style lookbook from them. Some girls shy away from online shopping but you can find 50% more online than in the brick and mortar stores and that's particularly true for some vendors that we love like Payless Shoes. Go to the Dressing Room link above and read the Savvy Shopper and subscribe to the newsletter on the front page for weekly shopping tips. It's all there for you Kelly.

Now you'll have a good start on how to dress well. Send me any personal questions you may have at {** email address deleted} and happy shopping my dear.
Hugs.....Tasi


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