No more mandatory heels

[Diana Michelle]

http://www.msn.com/en-us/lifestyle/what ... spartandhp

Like they say never criticize before you walk a mile in her shoes.

[Lacey Hadley]

First off there is no place for government to be involved in this situation. The restaurant, bar & grill, adult club and other similar businesses in industry is not one where the wearing of high heels is a safety issue. So as such the B.C. government had/has no place in telling what a lawful business and employer mandates as required dress code among its staff. As long as any and all staff were/are made aware of these dress codes prior to ACCEPTING employment, then there is NO ISSUE!

This era of looking at government to interfere, oversee and set up what is to be from what should be etc is quite repugnant. Dress codes are prevalent throughout business and industry and that includes high heels for ladies and tee hee any cder a who may or can wear such in our employment.

Where does government interference in business and industry in this regard stop then? Males often have to wear suits and ties to present an appropriate look for their field of employment. Many would like to prefer to wear their favorite running/sport shoes or even pair of Jesus boots (Birkenstocks etc.) over any dress shoes. We gonna see Gubment interfere here too? I DOUBT IT! This is mostly just a group of generally unsavory feminists and and whiny "look I'm a victim too" female employees with virtue signaling government looking for some voter appeal.

Simply this, these employees knew before they accepted the job that high heels with often shorter dresses or skirts are a part of the dress code. The industry that generally has females wearing heels and shorter dresses or skirts is one by design and profitability to sell in part on sex appeal. THIS IS LIFE! We human beings are a sexual species, like it or not!

Proper fitting shoes of a good general quality be they high heels are not uncomfortable. If a woman is trying to cram her size 9 feet into size 7 shoes be they heels or not, IT'S GONNA HURT AND BE UNCOMFORTABLE! Buying crappy shoes be they heels or not will not be as comfortable. And YES! as a CDer I have rightful cause to state this POV, as I have worn and wear high heel shoes and boots. Cheaper ones I found to be not so much fun or of comfort. Better and no it does not have to be mega priced female shoes and boots of high heels type but a quality above cheap shoes, I can wear for hours if I buy the right size for me.

From all this government interference and B.S. this is what will likely happen more often than not. During job interviews employers of most given, more adult based businesses will ask females before hiring if they are ok with wearing heels? Females who state they prefer not to will likely see their resumes have a higher probability tossed in to FILE 13. SIMPLE AS THAT! The industry that has females wearing heels often has sex appeal as a part of its profit generator.

Females who subsequently do not wear heels and not likely shorter dresses or skirts will have a negative effect on these businesses and will first likely see a fall in their tips and likely have their hours cut or better hours given to females who do dress as such. Yeah, yeah, I can hear "IT'S NOT FAIR!"

Well folks here is the point. LIFE IS NOT FAIR! GET OVER IT! Some of us have better attributes than others and so on. We each have things we have as strengths and others as weaknesses. Regarding high heels in said industries, A regular gal who does her hair nice, puts on makeup and steps into heels even without too short of a skirt or dress will likely with a good attitude do better and make more tips than say a more natural beauty who is snooty and sloppy with hair and/or makeup and no heels. Booze and male peer pressure can help free dudes of their money in such establishments. LIKE IT OR NOT SEX APPEAL SELLS!!!

Imagine now at a peeler bar or club, the dancer gonna come out with ballet flats on? Men and even women (IMO many are border line BI anyways) who may attend such bars/clubs do not want to see that. High heels make legs and buttocks look great and nicer legs and buttocks look even better.

Lots of family restaurants and other businesses that have no need for females wearing high heels for gals to choose to work at. That said not so much today with online banking but even today and more in the past when attending my local bank with female receptionists, tellers, financial officers if they generally had a nice hair style, sweet/classy makeup, classy clothes and a pair of heels be they boots or shoes all make the experience and time more enjoyable and classy.

[Eileen (SO)]

My working career allowed more casual footwear, although some women insisted on wearing heels. I agree that government has no business in business attire. Bank employees should look professional in all manner, implying that bank is a safe place for your money.
Implying that this ruling is for public health and safety is just wrong. Some women can wear heels comfortably, others can not. My husband can wear heels a longer time than I can. It's genetics, not gender that determines whether one can wear heels.

Eileen

[Andi B]

I'm told I look ten years younger when I go out. So if acting my age means not splurging on Hot Topic accents, then no.

No regrets.

[April Rose]

Sorry, Lacey, buy I don't agree at all. No employer should have the right to mandate a practice that scientific/medical consensus deems unhealthy.

[Eileen (SO)]

Respectfully, April Rose, you missed a major point to Lacey's post. If all women in Canada refused to wear high heels whether for work or casual, employers would have no one to hire. A free market would force employers to change their requirements to find a suitable workforce. Since there are plenty of women that can and will wear heels for certain jobs, they will be employed.

Socialist governments dictate how society dresses to conform. Government has no business telling my employer how I should dress. Don't like the dress code, find another job.

Eileen

[Lacey Hadley]

Sorry, Lacey, buy I don't agree at all. No employer should have the right to mandate a practice that scientific/medical consensus deems unhealthy.

April,

Please understand, I never said employers should force any women to wear heels, at least after she has been duly interviewed and hired and made clear heels are a part of the job. But if during the job interview process the employer states that the ladies wear heels here, then the applicant can choose to accept the job or not based on her personal stance. Free markets rule, governments have no place in telling employers what their dress codes shall be as long as the jobs at hand do not become a safety issue if one wears heels. Working in establishments that generally have females wear heels and often shorter dresses or skirts are not ones where heels are a safety issue.

There are numerous service, hospitality, restaurant businesses who hire staff with no requirements to wear heels. The ones that expect heels to be worn do it for a business model and for increased profitability. Like it or not, sex appeal sells and concerning in this case where businesses expect high heels and often shorter dresses on their female staff where businesses may benefit from such are doing so for making more money. The ladies will earn more money in professional businesses where dressing in high heels and skirts or dresses based on positive impressions. Add in places where things such tips are given the ladies who dress as such will make more tips too. A Chairman Mao type utopia, cough, cough distopia will not be good for employees, the business and the government tax stream.

We need less government not more and the B.C. government is sticking its political nose where it should not. The ladies who will work in establishments where high heels are demanded are/or should be adult girls and can/should be able to look out for themselves prior to accepting said employment. They do not need The Gubment doing it for them.

Again if I was an employer running a business with said dress code, I would do my best not to hire any ladies who refuse to wear heels and such, or if I did they would not likely get the plum work times. AND YES TO NOT APPEAR SEXIST AS I'M NOT!!! If my business said males are to wear dress shirts, ties, dress shoes and a blazer or even a suit then I would not try to hire any men who refuse to dress as such too. IT'S MY BUSINESS!!! Not the employees, nor the government and its sordid bureaucracy's.

[Rhanda]

I wasn't going to get into this one but here I am. I wonder if it would be alright to demand that men wear high heels? I happen to wear high heels almost all the time, whether I am dressed in fem or not. They just feel good on my feet.

Now, since someone mentioned government interference, I want to agree. The US has become almost as bad as I want to see it, in demanding that we give up our freedom for security. I am sorry to see that Canada is beginning to interfere with the people's rights as well.

Rhnda

[Lacey Hadley]

Rhanda,

In day to day society, businesses will not demand male workers wear heels (DARN! Would that not be great for us ) but dress codes extend to males too and many industries/business demand males dress in clothes/shoes that many males would rather not wear daily, but we really do not hear whining about that! Only virtue signaling politicians, bureaucrats and boo hooing women will do such about their dress codes for things such as heels, hose and types of dresses or skirts.

Dress codes extend to blue collar industry too. For instance my father has worked much of his working life in heavy industry manufacturing, he had to wear heavy coveralls even when inside the shop where summer time temps would reach 30-35+ Degrees C. / 80-90+degrees F. He had to wear heavy steel soled and toed work boots, do that 8+ hrs. a days during especially a hot summer. He'd for pure comfort would rather have worn Jesus boots (Birkenstocks or similar). So he tried to make it better by buying the best quality and fitting work boots he could afford. As to heavy coveralls, during winter he layered well enough to not freeze on the shop floor but still be moveable well enough to do his job and in summer he wore good quality but comfortable undershirts and work pants to not be too hot with the heavy coveralls on.

I already noted about businesses and men required to wear dress shirts, ties, suit jackets and dress shoes, be it winter, spring, summer or fall. I had to dress like that most of my business and working career. Nobody including my government cried for me, guys doing jobs/careers like me, or guys working in said work fields like my father did all had/have dress codes placed on him, them, me and us. But boo hoo some women are upset by being told that they are to wear high heels and as such, mostly inside in air conditioned businesses and the world should stop for them and their 1st. world plight! Governments only for political virtue signaling interfere in free market business and I hate that. If I ran such businesses then it's my Damn business. As long as I told any females prior to hiring them that they shall wear heels and maybe even only dresses/skirts including maybe shorter above the knee types, then too bad if they don't like it, they don't have to take the job. Businesses like these probably have a huge stack of Resumes to go through if/when need be. I'm sorry but no from me. I prefer to live in a general free market economy with minimal government interference please.

[Diana Michelle]

Lacey, I agree with you that in some cases government interference in business goes overboard however your arguments are rambling and to be honest you have some mixed ideas here. In your first post you say in bars and grills, restaurants, adult clubs, and similar businesses the wearing of heels poses no safety risk, I beg to differ. I am not going to address adult clubs after all where do you think the term stripper heels comes from but as for bars, restaurants, etc. the wearing of heels can present a safety issue. As someone who worked for close to 40 years as a consultant to the hospitality industry I have seen many kitchens, behind the bar, etc. where spills and water, food, and other substances are commonly on the floor. To walk in high heels requires a good sense of balance and foreign substances that can promote slips only makes wearing heels treacherous at the best. It you don't believe me try walking across a skating rink in 4" heels in any form other than shuffling your feet and you will see what I am saying.

As for your father's situation what I read is a safety factor as many factories, fabrication, and manufacturing facilities dictate and in may cases provide or at least subsidize the cost of the attire of their shop employees for the good of their employees. You omitted to say exactly what your father did but you and he should be thankful for the fact his employer was concerned for the safety of their employees whether it was by choice or government edict. For years employers dealing with hazardous materials and/or chemicals or potential carcinogens didn't even provide a simple breathing mask for their employees let alone safety glasses or protective clothing. Without government intervention and costly litigation how many do you think would do it today? Is that what we desire to return to?

As for companies with written dress codes requiring men to wear dress shirts, ties, and even jackets they most certainly have a similar dress code for female employees. I worked many years in skirted suits and yes heels. many of those were long days that may have required catching a flight to start or end the day and could have meant 16 hours or more in heels. Did I complain? Sure I did and I can remember more than one whine session with other business women about what we went through but that was our choice of profession and we knew the rules, written and unwritten, going in. Certainly a waitress balancing a tray full of meals and drinks is a different situation than a professional position.

Somehow I can't picture a hiring manager going through a dress code in detail even during a meeting concerning a job offer. I can imagine them saying something to the fact that we are business formal, business casual, free form or whatever. If women are required to heels how far do we go? Should we also dictate just how high a heel that should be; 2", 3", 4"? Who is responsible for measuring the heel height? What about a shoe that has a platform? Do you include the height of the platform or do you deduct that height from the heel height? Oh well there is a whole subchapter in the employee manual. Now if you are going to dictate footwear to the females you have to do the same for male employees after all what is good for the goose is good for the gander. Do you go as far as to say loafers regardless of how professional they appear are not allowed? How many eyelets for the laces? What about color? I have seen many a man wearing brown shoes with gray or even black suits. What comes next? Mandating female employees wear slips, male employees a t-shirt under their dress shirt? These too can be addressed in the section dealing with dress code in the employee manual. I hope you can see just how ridiculous this can get.

Yes if you own the business IMO you have every right to dictate a dress code for your employees. However it is also your responsibility to fully disclose the entire dress code to any prospective employee and should they accept the job they accept the dress code. Just be careful to be sure your dress code doesn't cross the line which can potentially lead to sexual harassment issues and all the legal problems that can lead to. Also be sure your dress code is not placing extraordinary rules on one gender or the other, again a potential for a discrimination lawsuit. I can tell you that personally if you were to lay out a dress code mandating skirts or dresses and 4" heels I know what I would tell you to do with your job and I am sure there are many females that would do the same.

Yes the term "business casual" has muddied the waters as to me or you or someone else casual can mean different things and in too many cases people tend to push the envelope too far but that is for the employer to address. If one finds the attire of a business' employees then they have the option to simply not do business with that firm. It will get through if enough people stop doing business and the owners or managers are sharp enough to see the trend and start asking the right questions of former customers. Early on in my career someone told me if you want to advance dress at least as good as your immediate supervisor and if possible his supervisor. If that still holds true it may explain why employees feel comfortable dressing as they do.

[April Rose]

Safety rules are one thing; requiring a person to violate their own health or safety for some "image" is something entirely different.

[Amanda R]

As one who works as a waitress I cannot imagine being able to work in 1" heels let alone anything taller. I work part time but I have done 8 hour or longer shifts and trust me when you get home your legs ache! Even with support hose and good walking shoes you know you have spent a day of running and lugging trays. To even consider mandating individuals in a restaurant situation to wear heels presents both health and personal safety issues. Thank heavens someone out there realizes it.

[Eileen (SO)]

I can't recall ever in my life, dining at a restaurant, where waitresses wore heels of any height. I do expect my bank manager, male or female, to dress less casual.

Why is this an issue?

Eileen

[Sarah Rene]

Why is this an issue?

Eileen

It isn't Eileen IMO either. To ask anyone in the food service to wear uncomfortable shoes would lead to a very employee turnover I would think.

I work as an office manager and for the office staff we have a corporate casual dress code. Granted every once in a while someone will try to push the edge but a quick word remedies the situation.