Hi girls,
I watched He's a lady on Tuesday and I saw something very interesting. Men bonding, not as men, but as women.
The first time was when the one guy was upset because he was overweight and felt he was not passable, and did not get any votes. The other guy encouraged him to keep his chin up, and then put some more lipstick on him.
The second time was at the end when the contestant who lost was asked to leave. He was hugged and treated warmly.
I have worked contruction most of my life and have not only seen, but have laid men off and fired them. Never have I seen hugs, or any kind of emotional support. Usually just the opposite.
It is my personal beleif that just being dressed as women, despite the fact that they most likely are not crossdressers, has brought out the feminine, compassonate, emathetic side of them. I beleive this is actually changing these men. It is my beleif that these men are getting in touch with a part of them they may have never even thought they had. It will be interesting to see, as this goes on.
I have also noticed that they desire to look and act more feminine than in the previous shows. One of the contestants decided to shave his underarms. I am now interested enough to continue watching because I see things happening to them, that happened to me. It is my beleief that these men will be changed for life as a result of thier experience. But only time will tell. Stay tuned.
I would be interested to hear what my sisters think?
Love always,
Elizabeth
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Elizabeth
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Virginia
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I agree Elizabeth, as I posted earlier it would be interesting to see these guys 5 - 10 years from now. The compassion and empaty they have shown each other is nice, but as they get further along and the $$$$'s begin to take hold, I mean, $250,000.00 is a lot of money and we all know the male ego and $$$"s I think it will get ugly before the end. But again, you are right I too think that it will change them for the rest of their lives!
Love ya,
Virginia
Love ya,
Virginia
First star to the right, then straight on 'till mornin!
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Beauty
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Hi Barbara,
That's not cynical at all. I think that's a very valid question. I would have agreed even. The one thing that makes me think it wasn't staged was applying lipstick for another person seems way to un-guy like. I don't think he thought about that. lol... What I actually think is he watched that at home and he and his guy friends cringed.
Regardless you bring up a good point about the cameras Barbara.
Beauty
That's not cynical at all. I think that's a very valid question. I would have agreed even. The one thing that makes me think it wasn't staged was applying lipstick for another person seems way to un-guy like. I don't think he thought about that. lol... What I actually think is he watched that at home and he and his guy friends cringed.
Regardless you bring up a good point about the cameras Barbara.
Beauty
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Elizabeth
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Hi girls,
All great points you bring up. And the least of which is $250,000. I am sure that with that kind of money at stake, and having cameras present, all are serious motivations for being more feminine. Like I said, time will tell on this.
What I am looking for are things that I beleive are part of the anima coming out, that the guys might not even be aware of. The two examples I picked, were because they involved men, touching other men in a compassionate way, in public. It is definitely not the social norm. Whether or not it is playing to the cameras or producers, time will tell. I hope.
Love always,
Elizabeth
All great points you bring up. And the least of which is $250,000. I am sure that with that kind of money at stake, and having cameras present, all are serious motivations for being more feminine. Like I said, time will tell on this.
What I am looking for are things that I beleive are part of the anima coming out, that the guys might not even be aware of. The two examples I picked, were because they involved men, touching other men in a compassionate way, in public. It is definitely not the social norm. Whether or not it is playing to the cameras or producers, time will tell. I hope.
Love always,
Elizabeth
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Dixie Darling
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Elizabeth,
I saw a LOT of "UNguy" (is that a new word???) things happening on the program. I also made note of the fact that some of these men are seeming to begin to actually ENJOY what they're doing. True, some of it was for the sake of the camera, but a lot of it is also spontaneous. There's a different kind of 'bonding' going on that's outside the way that guys usually bond to each other.
I've also noticed that there are also a couple of these guys who seem to be more "into" it than the rest and I'd almost bet you that (at least for one or two of them) this isn't the first time they've crossdressed and it certainly won't be the last. Not only that, but I wonder how many of them just might continue to explore their newly discovered femininity once the program's over.
One other thing. When I'm in guy mode, which is most of the time, I'm ALL guy. You'd never see any femininity in me at all. In fact I asked my non-tolerant wife recently just what had she EVER seen me do that was feminine looking and the ONLY thing she could respond with was the way I cross my legs. However, when I dress it's almost like I also 'put on' the femininity at the same time, and that's in the emotional, physical, and actions sense. I'm not sure, but I think I see this same thing happening on "He's A Lady" too. What y'all think?
Dixie - http://www.geocities.com/senorita_cd
I saw a LOT of "UNguy" (is that a new word???) things happening on the program. I also made note of the fact that some of these men are seeming to begin to actually ENJOY what they're doing. True, some of it was for the sake of the camera, but a lot of it is also spontaneous. There's a different kind of 'bonding' going on that's outside the way that guys usually bond to each other.
I've also noticed that there are also a couple of these guys who seem to be more "into" it than the rest and I'd almost bet you that (at least for one or two of them) this isn't the first time they've crossdressed and it certainly won't be the last. Not only that, but I wonder how many of them just might continue to explore their newly discovered femininity once the program's over.
One other thing. When I'm in guy mode, which is most of the time, I'm ALL guy. You'd never see any femininity in me at all. In fact I asked my non-tolerant wife recently just what had she EVER seen me do that was feminine looking and the ONLY thing she could respond with was the way I cross my legs. However, when I dress it's almost like I also 'put on' the femininity at the same time, and that's in the emotional, physical, and actions sense. I'm not sure, but I think I see this same thing happening on "He's A Lady" too. What y'all think?
Dixie - http://www.geocities.com/senorita_cd
"If you're going to LOOK like a lady, then ACT like one too!"
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DonnaT
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It does appear to me that a couple of them are into it also. I just hope that at home, they don't overcompensate by trying to appear more masculine than they were before the show. That could be disasterous for their relationships. Most appear to be on pretty solid ground though.
As for me, even dressed I don't recognize anything that I would do inadvertantly that was feminine. Sure, I practise a few things but find it a bit hard to keep it going. That is one of the scary things to me when contemplating getting fully dressed and appearing in public. That and how my wife might react to that femininity if I could project it. I once got in the drivers seat like a lady in a skirt and she asked "Since when do you get in like a girl?" The car was too close to the curb to do otherwise.
The "training" on the show, to me, was a bit over the top. I don't see women walking around with arms flailing or touching themselves in the manner these guys were being taught. Seeing a group of "women" walking around like they did, performing all the hand gestures, etc, would scream out to me that those are men.
As for me, even dressed I don't recognize anything that I would do inadvertantly that was feminine. Sure, I practise a few things but find it a bit hard to keep it going. That is one of the scary things to me when contemplating getting fully dressed and appearing in public. That and how my wife might react to that femininity if I could project it. I once got in the drivers seat like a lady in a skirt and she asked "Since when do you get in like a girl?" The car was too close to the curb to do otherwise.
The "training" on the show, to me, was a bit over the top. I don't see women walking around with arms flailing or touching themselves in the manner these guys were being taught. Seeing a group of "women" walking around like they did, performing all the hand gestures, etc, would scream out to me that those are men.
DonnaT
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Anita
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It's an interesting topic, and I think that these men will indeed be changed by it. It's not just "clothes" for me, personally--there is a whole set of behaviors and mannerisms that go with it. I see some of that happening with these guys. Unfortunately, we're just switching over to satellite at the household, and my TV was still not functioning on the new system, so I missed installment two.
As for the cameras rolling: in my experience, you forget about this very quickly. I (as Anita) was filmed for a movie last year--the crew shot about four hours of footage about my band. They filmed me going about the business of setting up for a photo shot, rehearsing, and then they shot backstage and onstage footage of a concert. I couldn't keep being self-conscious about the filmmakers; I had too many other things to do and think about. Especially when interacting with other band members; people say something, and I just react.
So I would agree that some of these guys will see things on film that will make them cringe later, because they're just reacting to what happens, and not thinking about, "how will this play?"
I still want to see how fully these guys go into female behavior. I know for myself that I tone down Anita's femme side some around friends and family. I don't care for this, but it's just too unsettling for them to see the all-out version of what I feel. The men on this show will feel that same conflict, but they're going to have to push through it if they want to be convincing.
Performing onstage I forget about toning it down, though--I just act, and from what I've seen on video, "Anita" comes through pretty strongly. I don't mind seeing this, but I imagine it could be upsetting to the contestants the first couple of times they see themselves really "letting go" into their femme roles.
As for the cameras rolling: in my experience, you forget about this very quickly. I (as Anita) was filmed for a movie last year--the crew shot about four hours of footage about my band. They filmed me going about the business of setting up for a photo shot, rehearsing, and then they shot backstage and onstage footage of a concert. I couldn't keep being self-conscious about the filmmakers; I had too many other things to do and think about. Especially when interacting with other band members; people say something, and I just react.
So I would agree that some of these guys will see things on film that will make them cringe later, because they're just reacting to what happens, and not thinking about, "how will this play?"
I still want to see how fully these guys go into female behavior. I know for myself that I tone down Anita's femme side some around friends and family. I don't care for this, but it's just too unsettling for them to see the all-out version of what I feel. The men on this show will feel that same conflict, but they're going to have to push through it if they want to be convincing.
Performing onstage I forget about toning it down, though--I just act, and from what I've seen on video, "Anita" comes through pretty strongly. I don't mind seeing this, but I imagine it could be upsetting to the contestants the first couple of times they see themselves really "letting go" into their femme roles.
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Elizabeth
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Anita,
You bring up some really interesting points, based on experience. I have too been filmed while playing, although not for a production. And at first I was thinking about the camera, but it was not long before I completely forgot about it, and was interacting with the band as usual. I often get lost in the music and not only dont remember playing a certain song, but forget playing the last several songs, similar to when you are driving and don't remember how you got to where you were, because you were lost in thought.
I think the whole point of reality tv is that your average schmoe can only act for so long, and the stress forces them to reveal thier true selves. In social settings men, except very close freinds, don't touch unless it is to cause pain or embarrassment. It is my personal beleif that these men are being encouraged to "be female" by the entire production team. They are bascially isolated in "The Dollhouse" Also not an accident, imho. They are not feeling pressure to be masculine, and are in fact rewarded for feminine behavior.
Along with Maggie's post that also deals with a straight male crossdressing for reasons other than desire or necessity, this show is also dealing with this very same issue of how feminine men really are. I included the link to her thread for those interested.
http://crossdressers-forum.com/forums/v ... highlight=
Very intersting stuff, this gender thing.
Love always,
Elizabeth
You bring up some really interesting points, based on experience. I have too been filmed while playing, although not for a production. And at first I was thinking about the camera, but it was not long before I completely forgot about it, and was interacting with the band as usual. I often get lost in the music and not only dont remember playing a certain song, but forget playing the last several songs, similar to when you are driving and don't remember how you got to where you were, because you were lost in thought.
I think the whole point of reality tv is that your average schmoe can only act for so long, and the stress forces them to reveal thier true selves. In social settings men, except very close freinds, don't touch unless it is to cause pain or embarrassment. It is my personal beleif that these men are being encouraged to "be female" by the entire production team. They are bascially isolated in "The Dollhouse" Also not an accident, imho. They are not feeling pressure to be masculine, and are in fact rewarded for feminine behavior.
Along with Maggie's post that also deals with a straight male crossdressing for reasons other than desire or necessity, this show is also dealing with this very same issue of how feminine men really are. I included the link to her thread for those interested.
http://crossdressers-forum.com/forums/v ... highlight=
Very intersting stuff, this gender thing.
Love always,
Elizabeth
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Virginia
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Donna,
The girl on the first set was at the Southern Comfort in Atlanta this year and she is GOOD! One thing she said was "girls are pullers, while men are pushers!" Referencing hand and arm movements. GG's tend to pull things imiginary or not to them and to keep their elbows in and "make themselves small." I started noticing GG's and it is so true, just small gestures can make a world of difference!
Virginia
The girl on the first set was at the Southern Comfort in Atlanta this year and she is GOOD! One thing she said was "girls are pullers, while men are pushers!" Referencing hand and arm movements. GG's tend to pull things imiginary or not to them and to keep their elbows in and "make themselves small." I started noticing GG's and it is so true, just small gestures can make a world of difference!
Virginia
First star to the right, then straight on 'till mornin!
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Carol Ann
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I too enjoy the show but remember the plot is to act an be a women totally.
These guys must have some off screen help in all aspecks, makeup for starters. In such a short time they have master things I have tryed to learn for years. #2 at the end of the show when they are to be judge I can not believe someone didn't pick out thier cloths for them (just to perfect). I'm looking forward to when they have to go to thier hometowns and live as women for a full month. In all truth I do enjoy watching just to see what I can learn.
Carol Ann
These guys must have some off screen help in all aspecks, makeup for starters. In such a short time they have master things I have tryed to learn for years. #2 at the end of the show when they are to be judge I can not believe someone didn't pick out thier cloths for them (just to perfect). I'm looking forward to when they have to go to thier hometowns and live as women for a full month. In all truth I do enjoy watching just to see what I can learn.
Carol Ann-
Miss Britney
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reality tv at it's best?
my girl and i watched this the other day and i was very intrigued. i think a lot of good points were brought up already about the motivations behind the "unguy" behavior. i also noticed how quick some guys were going back to their testoterone filled selves once they were eliminated. the interesting thing for me is to see the small details that change in their body language and social skills when they are dressed up. it is also very revealing to see how the producers view men and women and where they draw the lines on gender.
why is the world terrified of itself?
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Elizabeth
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Hi girls,
I personally thought it would have been better if they had to learn themselves. And select thier own clothes, and have to actually shop for them thier clothes. It would have made the show more of a competition, in my opinion.
So I am wondering if this is not also the same. Does dressing feminine, and making an concious effort to act feminine, bring out ones true femininity, ones "anima" that Jung spoke of. The repressed feminine side of us males. That is what I am interested in, and is the subject of this thread.
Time wil tell.
Love always,
Elizabeth
Yes, they have professional help with everything. Pro makeup artists, clothing is already selected and on the racks for them. They have been given training on female mannerisms, such as how to walk, and run in high heels.Carol Ann wrote:
These guys must have some off screen help in all aspecks, makeup for starters. In such a short time they have master things I have tryed to learn for years. #2 at the end of the show when they are to be judge I can not believe someone didn't pick out thier cloths for them (just to perfect).
I personally thought it would have been better if they had to learn themselves. And select thier own clothes, and have to actually shop for them thier clothes. It would have made the show more of a competition, in my opinion.
This also is what interests me the most. I have mentioned in another thread that if you smile, it will put you in a good mood, if you frown it will put you in a bad mood, if you put an angry look on your face it will make you feel angry. Our brain connects the behaviors, even in reverse.Miss Britney wrote:
the interesting thing for me is to see the small details that change in their body language and social skills when they are dressed up.
So I am wondering if this is not also the same. Does dressing feminine, and making an concious effort to act feminine, bring out ones true femininity, ones "anima" that Jung spoke of. The repressed feminine side of us males. That is what I am interested in, and is the subject of this thread.
Time wil tell.
Love always,
Elizabeth