In part Kathy wrote:
So, how did they get this identity? Chances are it was assigned to them by someone else. Perhaps it is the need to latch on to some "identity" in the first place that is holding them back?
Your thoughts? Anyone?
That could be a complex question. There are probably more opinions about it but I will concern myself with two of them.
First I am not to concerned about what the cause is, because understanding the cause does not translate into finding a solution.
And second we were born into it. We were born into an imperfect world. I was born into a family that one of my parents was/is a sadist. And guess who her victim was. I was used to meet her needs that she could not get met any other way. It is called abuse. Have you seen the picture of Elizabeth dressed in a dress as a little boy? Have you read her account of the ridicule she endured as a result? It is called abuse. What kind of an Identity do you expect people like us to have? You know ones identity is tied in with their self worth?
It is impossible to change ones self worth with out a change in identity. Ones identity is all about how one feels about themselves.
Here was something that helped me make a lot of sense out of the crossdressing aspect of my identity.
Like a lot of us I started out about 8 years old. I knew deep in my soul that if folks knew the other boys my age would ridicule me, and that an object of ridicule is somehow less than. (Although I did once manage to dare a bunch of other boys into joining me. Then I was worried they would tell on me. Somehow it was still all about my being less than)
In adult life I began to no longer accept the whole notion of one person being less than another. I told a few people about my cross dressing. A girl friend and a whole college classroom of total strangers. It helped.
Some years later I was in therapy. I told the therapist about it briefly. The next week I told him that I felt uncomfortable about having told him this, as if it made me some sort of wierdo. He asked why should I feel ashamed of feeling close to another person to the point of wanting to wear some of their clothes. He seemed to think it was all sort of normal.
Not everyone in life is as understanding as him and there is more to my CDing than that. But it was one of those priceless moments of clarity.
Andrea
everything under the sun is in tune
but the sun is eclipsed by the moon
In part Loretta wrote:First I am not to concerned about what the cause is, because understanding the cause does not translate into finding a solution.
On this point I will respectfully agree to disagree. I see it as a matter of cause & effect. Eliminate the cause and, by nature, you eliminate the effect.
Now, this is where the discussion could easily devolve into "Hot Topics". I don't wish to go there so I will leave it at that.
Love,
Kathy
Whatever you accomplish in life is a manifestation not so much of what you do, as of what you believe deeply within yourself that you deserve. - Les Brown
On this point I will respectfully agree to disagree. I see it as a matter of cause & effect. Eliminate the cause and, by nature, you eliminate the effect.
On that point all I have to say is Goooood Luck!!!! in creating a perfect world.
I'll not be sticking around for that to happen. But thank you anyway for letting me know how you think about it. It does tell me some more about you.
Now, this is where the discussion could easily devolve into "Hot Topics". I don't wish to go there so I will leave it at that.
And on this point you should know me well enough to know that I do not stick around for arguments.
Whatever you accomplish in life is a manifestation not so much of what you do, as of what you believe deeply within yourself that you deserve. - Les Brown
While I wear many hats and do many different things I am always me. Just sometimes I am more femme than other times.
Site Administrator
I am a physically male person that likes to wear feminine clothes at times.
Just trying keep a balance for my self along with keeping my wife and kids in mind.
No Kidding?.... Really?.... Your sure that is all there is to it?
Just me Hey?
Reason for asking is that I am trying to understand, why one would want to give themselves that kind of a label?
I wonder how well that label would sell when attempting to gain acceptance? Seriously anyone approaching me with that kind of an identity would not get very far. As it sends a signal that there is something about that person, they don't want me to know about.
And yes that is something I would definitely look for.
The point I am trying to get at here is that one assumes that they are avoiding labels by saying that they are just me. When in fact nothing is farther from the truth.
>> No Kidding?.... Really?.... Your sure that is all there is to it?
>> Just me Hey?
Why does it need to be more? Are you uncomfortable with the fact that you can not put a label on me? If you are that would put you with alot of people. Many if they can not put a label on someone or that someone's actions, looks, possesions, job function; can not relate to that person.
>> Reason for asking is that I am trying to understand, why one would >> want to give themselves that kind of a label? d'oh!
My LABEL is my male name. Here and other forums it is KimberlyS.
>> I wonder how well that label would sell when attempting to gain
>> acceptance? Seriously anyone approaching me with that kind of an
>> identity would not get very far. As it sends a signal that there is
>> something about that person, they don't want me to know about.
>>
>> And yes that is something I would definitely look for.
>>
>> The point I am trying to get at here is that one assumes that they are
>> avoiding labels by saying that they are just me. When in fact nothing
>> is farther from the truth. Shame on you
I said I wear many hats. To others these hat may be label to allow others to relate to me. But to me I do not go by one specific hat/label. I am just me. If you want to get my attention in a crowd you call my name.
If you want to relate to me better here are the hats I wear. Most likely labels to you.
I AM:
- born a physically male person.
- lead a basically normal child hood doing both "Male" and "Female" things growing up.
- someone who likes to do things out side with my hands.
- someone who likes to make things grow.
- someone who likes to make things with wood.
- a fixer.
- a construction worker.
- a roofer.
- an electrician.
- a plumber. (only when I have to be)
- a lumber jack.
- a builder.
- a brick layer.
- a concrete person.
- a painter.
- a cook.
- a dishwasher.
- one that likes to sew.
- a maid.
- a house cleaner.
- washer.
- a laundry service.
- a food shopper.
- a clothes shopper.
- a machanic.
- a taxi driver.
- a provider.
- a bill payer.
- head and protector of my family.
- a partner of my wife.
- a husband.
- a lover.
- a friend to my wife.
- dedecated to my wife.
- a spouse.
- a parent.
- a father.
- a Dad.
- a mentor to my kids and others.
- a friend to my kids.
- known as my kids dad or parent.
- a friend to others.
- a brother.
- a cousin.
- an uncle.
- a Christian.
- a nerd.
- a geek.
- a network administrator.
- a computer guy.
- the guy who can fix your computer. (at least they think so)
- the guy with the chainsaw.
- the guy with the power tools.
- the "Tim the Tool Man" type guy.
- the guy who helps people move.
- someone with stress in his life.
- a femmine guy.
- a crossdresser.
- a guy in a dress.
- a strange person.
- a weird-o.
- someone who is strong.
- someone who is weak.
- a guy with his ears pierced, "Both of them".
- a helper.
- a loner.
- a quiet person.
- an envolved person.
- a busy person.
- an over weight person.
- /was a running.
- a neighbor.
- the guy down the block.
- a house sitter.
- an employee.
- a consultant.
- a helping hand.
- a care taker of parents.
- ........
So you pick how you want to label me and relate to me. But to me I am all of them. I am not any one of them. They are all me.
Some say when they dress they become someone different or take on different personalities. For me I just feel like me just a bit more relaxed and nervous at the same time. I do not feel girly, like a woman, or femmine. I still feel like a guy, I just like the feel of female clothing. I already have femmine characteristics all the time.
In fact while I have dressed fully and do enjoy that, I have come to realize that I would rather just dress as a "guy in a dress". And that would be a decent looking guy in a dress some days more femmine than others. Some days all male clothes, some days all female clothes. Seldom wearing any makeup, but maybe some lipstick, and and mostlike never a wig. But i would always be presenting me. Just like now some days I wear nicer clothes than others, i just would ad somedays more femmine than others. But for now the town where I live is not ready for that, so I will stick to dressing at home, and if I ever go out again it would be in full female look. And I am ok with that, because I am still me.
So who am I? What is my Idenity? My Identity is determined by? It is determined by all of the above and alot more. How others identify me and label me is up to them as I do not really care. To me my label is my male name and I am all of the above and more. I am just me.
Site Administrator
I am a physically male person that likes to wear feminine clothes at times.
Just trying keep a balance for my self along with keeping my wife and kids in mind.
Well you have certainly given your self enough labels, (being as many of your hats are labels) which indicates you are not one of those who does not need any labels. Therefore what you have described above does not fit this thread unless you agree with me that all labels are not something to avoid.
Ya we are all known by our given names, and most of us can do many different things. But I have no desire to be known by them, we are more than that.
Each and every one of us identify with something other than the things we are able to do. Labels are designed to tell others about us, (and they also tell us something about ourselves in terms of self worth.) and the only thing "just me" tells me is that one has a reason for identifying themselves as such.
Our given name is a label for our body only. It was given to us before we could do anything more than cry. All the rest came later and is quite another package that sets us apart from others "I am just me" tells me nothing about that package.
Why the need for just me? Your just me and my just me are entirely two very different things.
In conclusion: I can't help but think the only reason one would post the kind of thing that is in your second last post at the stage of this thread that you did, would be because one is looking for an argument.
I am not here for that. If you want to carry this any farther please start your own thread and run with it as you please. I have probably gone further than I should have, by entertaining this stuff, and I am not prepared to entertain any more of it here. I am simply not willing to drink from that part of the stream.
Don't bother to answer this here, because this conversation is now over As I am out of it.
Darla wrote:Hi i voted that i don't need lables because it's true, the whole world seems to be put into groups and i don't like that.
Hi Darla,
I am not surprised by your response, but I fail to see how that benefits you? There will be things about this world that we all do not like as long as we are on this planet. You may think you don't need labels but you are stuck with them whether you like it or not. They are simply unavoidable.
For examples this very forum is a group of people with a label that you have freely joined. Your nationality is a label (another group of people consisting of more groups with in.) Do you also reject that?
This thread has really given me cause to question some assumptions that I had. (RE: the perceived extra intelligence that we like to lay claim to as cross dressers) Sure looks like there no shortage of denial lurking around here.
You/we are simply not all alike, (and never will be) and that puts us into a group whether you like it or not.
Without labels communication would be impossible. If it were it would sure be nice as no one would be able to disagree with or criticize another. Do you think that might make for a more peaceful world? (Pun definitely intended)
I'm starting to get a little foggy here about what this thread is about. It's asking questions about what others feel, but it seems that you're trying to convert people in their thinking?
I thought you were asking other people questions and they are supposed to type what they feel, but it seems you're challenging everyone to their thoughts lately?
