I broke up with him

[Georgia(SO)]

Oh Jenny,

I'm so sorry about this. Having been in a similar relationship, I can tell you that being frozen with fear, wondering whether to make a scene and call attention to the problem or whether to sit quietly and let him get it out of his system is the best course, wondering if I had some responsibility in his behavior - all of this is totally and completely normal. It is normal for women whose SOs actually inflict serious physical harm - much more so when it is more threats than actual punches. I can remember watching Oprah, many years ago, and thinking that if my then-husband ever *hit* me, I'd leave. Of course I would. Uhmmm... except that it took me years to realize that while he hadn't actually *hit* me, he had twisted my arm around behind me a number of times, tried to push me down a flight of stairs, knocked me to the floor and pulled me across the floor to another room by my hair.

Now why this didn't register as *abuse* for another 5 years is beyond me, but it didn't, and all I could think of was a) how to keep him calm enough to keep it from happening again, b) the brilliant things I could have said that would have made him see the error of his ways (yeah right), and c) that if I reported this it would be so destructive to his career and on and on and on.

Now, I'm not suggesting that you did anything wrong. In fact, you seem to have done everything right. And I'm not suggesting that you should press charges (they are quite hard to prove, etc). What I am suggesting is that you quit thinking that you screwed up somewhere - either in not seeing him for what he really is (a bully), or in going with him (you went somewhere public, in your own car - good thinking), or in any other way. You did fine. Truly, this is always a ticklish situation and it is hard to know what is the best thing to do. But please understand that this is not, NOT, your fault in any way, shape or form.

You can feel free to PM me if you need to...

-georgia(so)

[Absaroka]

Jennifer, unless you did something that you have left out in a really big way, I don't see how any of this is your fault. You gave someone the benefit of the doubt and attempted to treat them like an intelligent mature adult. When they didn't get what they wanted they reacted like a two year old. When he got home do you suppose he threw his rattle on the floor and broke his toys too?

You need to do what is right for you. What is right for him is for him to not go around assaulting people and risking arrest. And this was definitely an assault and a criminal action on his part. What's next? If a burglar breaks into your house and steals your stuff will you not file charges because who knows, maybe the burglar would lose his job too?

Your ex is responsible for his behavior and the consequences of his behavior. And having you feel sorry for him, or guilty or any of that sort of thing, is just another weapon in his arsenal of abuse.

I am not saying you should have him arrested. That is your decision. All I am saying is that if you did it would have been because of what he has done, not because of any character flaw in you.

I guess the good news is that he has completely shown you his true colors. I hope that next time he attemps to "apologize" you can remember this.

Talking to your boss and your neighbors is probably a good idea. You would want to know if they see him hanging around.

I would doubt that you are not the first woman he has abused or the last one either. If he does it again you might as well get him into the criminal justice system. It might make it easier for his next girlfriend when (not if) he starts to do the same things to her.

Absaroka

[Jess(SO)]

Jennifer,

glad you are okay, shaken but okay.

Can I suggested you get a personal alarm and keep it in an easily reachable pocket at all times, not your handbag as it will only get lost in there when/if you need it.

I really do hope that you are never tempted to listen to this guy again

take care hun

Jess

[Stephanie W]

Hi Jennifer

I'm so sorry to hear of your frightening experience with your ex. He certainly doesn't deserve an ounce of your compassion. If nothing else, you now know your decision to leave him was absolutely the right one! Geez, you've had a lot to deal with over the last little while but you're hanging in there girl, so keep it up. My advice would be not to look back any more, focus on your future, but most of all, do what feels right for you.

You have a lot of friends here rooting for ya! Stay safe and look after Jennifer.

Stephanie

[Lisa(SO)]

Jennifer,

My heart goes out to you! You need to remember that you are a strong woman and nobody can take your self-worth from you.

I guess I’m just as stupid as he said I am.

Please do not let him take your self esteem! This helps to define who you are. As a friend of mne says, " Pull yourself up by the bootstraps, wipe off the dust, hold your head up high, and never look back. "

We are here for you!!

[Tammy Lynn]

hi jenny

jenny your father or family meens alot to you no matter what
it is. keep close to your father. i grew up without my father an he nose about me. but you have to remember he loves you no matter what the life is is we make chouces in or life rether it is good or bad. i crossdress for 30 years. an i dont have kids but if i did an my kids crossdress i will be there for them. i spent christmas with my bestfreinds family. an he like brother to me my. i had it rough threw the years. my died of cancer in 1999. my dad was in prison when i was 15 i did not have a mail role mottal from him. but i still love him no matter what jenny. me an him is catching up on life but i no he will pass on an we will i dont have to worry about what i could of said to him while he was living.
love your dad go out shopping dont blaim him for the problems your going threw. make the good chouces not the bad. take care an pray.

[JenniferMu.(GG)]

Well, what’s happened in the last couple of weeks is that I’ve left my day job and am now working full time in the restaurant business.
My boss has a few restaurants and I’ve got as much work with him as I want, so I’m working 7 days a week now for a while until the busy season quietens down, and that’s occupying my mind more now so I don’t have a lot of time to think about other things, and it gives me more time during the day to myself which is good, because it’s the night time when I feel vulnerable to him, so if I’m working into the late hours then I’m safe, and my boss is paying for taxis home for me, so it’s only the short distance from the cab to my front door where I feel a bit shakey. I’ve seen him a couple of times but he hasn’t approached me, but it tells me he still hasn’t moved on completely.

From the bottom of my heart I thank you all for your concern and I feel so much warmth in what you all write, it’s just hard to believe there can be so much affection from people on the other side of the world.
I’ve just been sitting here reading again what you all wrote and it’s making me feel a bit guilty because it’s obvious that some of you have seen between the lines that there’s a bit more to what’s sent him off the planet than what I’ve said before.

I wasn’t sure if it was the right thing to do to bring it all up on here because there’s strict rules about what we can talk about openly, but seeing you’ve all been so good to me and obviously care some, I’ll tell all about it and if the mods want to delete it then I’ll understand.

When we started going together it was just fab, it was one of those things which just seemed to hit us both like a bomb, everything was just so wonderful and I used to spend so much time every day daydreaming about him and I just couldn't get him out of my mind day and night and he was so attentive and nice and I thought I’d found the perfect man.

But I guess all you people know what happens as time goes on. One kiss and cuddle leads to other things and steamy moments can carry you away and all that sort of thing.
Anyway, the whole trouble started over sex. It wasn’;t a big deal at the start but it got worse and worse.
You see I’ve never gone all the way with a guy and he never believed me when I told him I hadn’t and I wasn’t ready for that sort of thing yet. He said over and over that in this day and age twenty year old virgins just don’t exist and if they do then there’s something wrong with them. He used to go on and on about I’d have had to have guys chasing me for years and lots of boy friends and he just wouldn’t believe that I’d only ever had one real boy friend and it never really became anything so serious. I treid to tell him that I’d gone to school until I was nearly 18 and boys and dating weren’t my thing at that time because I was so focused on my education and getting into Uni.
But I was in a situation where I couldn’t tell him the whole truth because I couldn’t tell him I dropped out of school in my final year because of the trauma it caused me finding out my Dad wore womens clothes and it was all the stuff which has gone on since with Mum and Dad divorcing and that sort of stuff and my mind wasn’t tuned into boyfriends or that.

So, he’s been saying now that I’m some sort of loser dropping out of school and nto going on with getting into Uni, but my life has changed in a lot of ways, even with what Gran did leaving me all that money which I’ll get in the years ahead, so I can focus on getting experience and wisdom now and getting into business when the time comes in five years.

But it’s the sex bit which sent him off the rails. He used to get so steamed up and me too I admit, but I always said no at the last moment and that got worse and worse. I know it’s my fault and the blame is mine and I used to feel such a heel when he verbally got stuck into me and he said if I really loved him then I’d do it with him. The thing is I did love him, I cared for him so much and I suppose I still love him, it just doesn’t get killed like that, but I didn’t want to do it with anyone and surely that’s my right to make that decision. I know guys call us certain names for not letting them go all the way,but it wasn’t that I never loved him, it was just that I wanted to keep something personal to myself for abit longer till I was more sure. Yes it was hard and there were times when I thought I’;d throw caution to the wind, but I was able to stop in time and that sent him hopping mad.

Now I’ve spent so much time trying to work out the difference between love and sex. Where does one stop and the other start or is it that if two people love each other then part of that love pact includes sex and it’s obligatory. Can you have love without the act of sex? I don’t know because I haven’t experienced it. I’d like to of course but I don’t know if there’s a way to define real love so that it has to be sealed with sex. I think about my mother and father and the beautiful life they used to have together and how it just ended like that because of what he does and I think that if we were married then you don’t go into marriage thinking one day you’ll get divorced, but seeing we weren’t even engaged and even though I loved him I wasn’t thinking about marriage, I’m a long way from ever thinking along those lines, well, at this stage of my life that’s how I think, and I used to think that I didn’t want to become a ‘statistic’ like some of my girls friends have, where they gave in and then got discarded and talked about. Surely I have the right to do what I wish with my own body, or am I being selfish and cruel as he says and just a tease, well that was never my intention, things happen and some things don’t happen and I may be different to most 20 year old girls as he says but that’s how I feel about it at this stage of my life.

So that’s it all now and maybe that’ll explain his actions better. I guess you could say it’s now all his fault because I think he really loves me still and for him you have to have sex with love…Well in time that would have come I guess, but he just gets so riled up and out of control when I switched off so it was mostly my fault and for that I feel awful and I think maybe I shouldn’t have got into steamy cuddles with him and let him get so steamed up, but I couldn’t help it because, well you know how it is I suppose.

I know men get angry and frustrated and for that it’smy fault and my blame but that’s how I feel. I think of what Gran said a few times that I would probably have problems with men, but I never dreamed it’d be this bad, but I guess it’s part of the experience of life.
Anyway, thanks for your words of wisdom, you’re wonderful people and I’ve taken so much out of what you all write.

Jenny.

[Stephanie W]

Hi Jennifer

Once again, thanks for sharing your feelings with us. Don't you worry about your post being inappropriate for this forum. On the contrary, I'm just glad you're able to talk to us like you do and am pleased you are comfortable among your friends here.

Let me start by saying you have absolutely NOTHING to be sorry or ashamed for. My goodness, it's your body and your life and you are old enough to make your own choices in life so be proud of those choices and don't second guess yourself just because your ex can't deal with rejection. Sucks to be him! Yes, guys don't like being led on but you've made it clear to him that you're not ready and he shoud be respecting that - no questions asked! Because he can't get what he wants, he resorts to the cowards way out by accusing you of being the problem or that 20 year old virgins don't exist. That's B*S so don't you listen to that. If he truly loved you, he wouldn't be saying those things.

When it comes to love and sex, we are all different in how we are affected by the attentions of another and how we deal with it. Much depends of course on the person, and the feelings we have for them. The old saying "you just KNOW when he or she is the one' is a pretty good rule of thumb. If you don't feel it, then it's not. All the will in the world won't make you love that person if you don't feel it in your heart, least of all, the desire to share one of the most intimate parts of you. For many people, I would say that love comes first and then consummating that love when the time is right for both of you should only happen when you are BOTH ready.

The old adage is that men don't generally need to be in love to want sex. Ok, perhaps that's true for most, but for a woman, it's the opposite, so that makes you no different from the majority of women out there. Honestly.

My advice if you ever find yourself trying to explain your reluctance to have sex with him is to stay away from anything to do with your Dad. Sadly, I see that only as aggravating an already difficult situation with him stalking you as he does. That knowledge could end up him making your life hell and using that as leverage to get what he wants from you so don't even go there. Not that he even deserves an explanation the way he's treated you, but I would say your parents divorce is traumatic enough for any person and leave it at that.

Jennifer, you're old enough to make your own decisions, but I would suggest you're better off without him. I think you know that though - right? As long as you stay away from this guy, you'll be better able to focus on you and your happiness. Congratulations on the new job and good luck with that. To repeat myself, remember, you have nothing to apologize for or be ashamed of. On the contrary, you should be darn proud of yourself for being such a responsible girl.

Stephanie

[Absaroka]

Jennifer I don't think you shared anything innappropriate.

Okay here it is from a guy about sex.

First of all, you love your mom, your dad, your siblings, your grandmother, right? All without any sex. We can most certainly love people without sex. I actually deeply love one of my exes and all we ever have is a hug and kiss on the cheek, the same as she gives my wife.

But perhaps that's not what you are asking. Can you have a romantic love affair without sex? Well a lot of older married couples certainly do. And so do a lot of teenagers. There may come a time in a relationship where if there is not sex that one partner may wish to reevaluate the relationship, but it should be done with respect, not manipulation, coercion, guilt and threats.

For sex to be an expression of love it has to be mutually desired and comfortable for both. If you really love someone the idea of them having sex with you when they don't want to will be very upsetting and you will not want to do it even though you may be quite aroused, because you don't want to cause them pain. Believe this and if anyone tries to tell you otherwise run as fast as you can in the other direction.

A lot of guys (and this is something we don't like to talk about much) use sex as reassurance of love. She has sex with me so she must love me. The sort of thing girls are supposed to do but a lot of guys do the same thing and just don't admit it. Because we are not always good at expressing our feelings or vulnerabilty ( except for that one oh so acceptable male feeling, anger) rejection of sex can feel very personal to us. But coerced love is not love at all and in the end leaves us feeling worse than before.

And yes it's not a good idea to lead guys on sexually. Younger men get very frustrated with this. Older and wiser men just get annoyed and decide to avoid women who do this.

None of this excuses your boyfriends actions in any way. You feel like you led him on but he was pressuring you. So rather than deciding to torment him with desire to get something from him you were in fact trying to be thoughtful and realizing you didn't want to do something. We all learn from these things. If he had not tried so hard to manipulate you this would not have happened.

Heres another thing. He's quite a bit older than you are. A confused 16 year old boy is one thing. A grown man, which is what he is in years if not maturity, has had ample opportunity to learn how to handle these things. He is not an innocent child in the hands of a sophisticated older temptress. He should have been the one setting the tone in terms of consideration for each others feelings and making each other feel safe.

Don't believe his nonsense. He is trying to make you responsible for how he feels and what his actions were. These are the marks of a small child, not a grown man. Unfortunately he seems to be pretty good in his choice of victims which is why you are still feeling guilty over his inabitliy to treat you with the simple respect any human being deserves.

I really hope you will remember a lot about this relationship. There are warning signs galore here of what to drop a guy for immediately if your next boyfriend starts to do them.

Absaroka

[DonnaT]

I know it’s my fault and the blame is mine and I used to feel such a heel when he verbally got stuck into me and he said if I really loved him then I’d do it with him.

No, it wasn't even close to your fault. You told him how you felt, yet he didn't respect you enough to understand.

My wife and I stayed celibate even after we decided to marry. There's no shame in that. And we've been married 31+ years.

Your body, your choice. If a partner can't respect that, then they have no respect for you. I couldn't have a relationship with any who didn't respect me.

There are a lot of married couple in a bad relationship because they had sex resulting in a child, before they were ready, only to realize the weren't really in love nor desired to be committed to each other.

Don't second guess yourself on this.

[Georgia(SO)]

Jenny,

Real men do not bully a girlfriend who is not ready for sex. They do not tell her that something is wrong with her because she has never had sex before. Real men respect a woman's decision. AND, real men do not stalk women and hurt them when the woman decides she wants to do something different than what he wants.

What this guy is, and has been, doing is emotional abuse. Let me tell you a story from long ago. Once upon a time, I too was a young virgin. I was dating a guy who talked me into sex - this was the early 70s and *everyone* was doing it. (I'm trying to figure out how to write this without being graphic...). He told me about his previous girlfriend and the remarkable feats she performed on him - things I'd never even heard of, much less knew how to begin to do. Because I *loved* him, I tried to figure these things out, but I never seemed to be able to do them well enough to not hear "Well, Kathy could _____." I thought there was something wrong with me.

Eventually, I married him. He became more and more emotionally and physically abusive, but by then we had four kids and I was loathe to break up the family. When I'd finally had enough and was filing for a divorce, he asked why. Fifteen years of hurt came pouring out of me, including "And you always said Kathy could do XYZ...". I was somewhat shocked to hear it come out of my mouth - I didn't know it still hurt. But what shocked me the most was what he said. Tearfully (abusers can and do cry), he said, "I don't know why I said that. Kathy wouldn't do anything until we were married. I was virgin with you."

You cannot imagine how stunned I was. He had LIED about what he had done previously, and what his former girlfriend could do, in order to manipulate me into doing what he wanted me to.

Jenny, your ex BF is behaving the same way. He is, and has been, trying to manipulate you into doing something you weren't ready for and into continuing your relationship when you would like to leave. He is, and has been, trying to make you feel as if you have done something wrong, as if you are doing something terrible to him. You aren't. You didn't.

Someday you will meet a real man - one who is secure enough in himself to respect your wishes and to treat you as you deserve to be treated.

Keep talking to us if you like. We'll all be here for you....

-georgia(so)

[Absaroka]

Jennifer reading this again I have to add some things.

When a relationship does not meet our needs we must re evaluate it. If we are considering marriage and want children and the other party does not, or refuses to have sex, we may tearfully but respectfully tell them we need to find someone who is on the same page as us. If we are in a romantic relationship for the long term the same may be true.

But the key here is respect. Most guys have a huge repetoire of behaviors they develop over the years to try to get sex. With maturity we learn to abandon the behaviors that are manipulative and learn to treat sex as something that must be freely given. Your ex is obviously not there.

At his age he should have learned that if things get hot and heavy but then he will get frustrated, that it is his responsibility to say that he doesn't want to get hot and heavy in the first place, or else find a way to deal with the frustration. Period. Again, he is not some clueless 15 year old. Period. End of discussion.

Sex with an unwilling partner is rape. You can be in the act, in the middle of consensual sex, and if one partner says stop and the other does not, it very quickly becomes rape. Court cases have upheld this although there is disagreement about the time needed. Here in the States however the time is measured in seconds.

I will share with you one of my experiences when I was younger. I had a girl friend with whom I had a very good sexual relationship. One night as we were fooling around I wanted to stop. The reason was simple, incipient food poisoning from dinner that night. I told her I didn't want to but she was insistent. We wound up doing it anyway with me feeling pretty ill and not enjoying it at all. Most of my attention was focused on not having diarhea in the bed in the middle of her enjoying herself. I thought at the time I was being thoughtful and considerate of her needs.

A month later or so one night I wanted sex and she didn't. I was pretty mad and also confused. I told her she should do it anyway, after all I had aquiesced to her demands that other time. (We both remembered it well as we were both violently ill for a couple days after)

She was somewhat upset and said that she really hadn't understood just how much no had meant no. She told me that if I ever felt that way again to please be far more adamant and asked me to forgive her. in truth, like most boys that age I was clueless as to how to tell a girl I did not want to have sex. It's something a lot of guys aren't good at and causes us problems. Some months later she told me that as a former date rape victim herself she had felt guilty about her actions for a long time, at which point I told her not to, that as far as I was concerned that it had been a failure to communicate and a learning experience. I guess a major factor was that in general I felt safe with her and completely believed her when she said that she didn't understand.

I guess my point is that yes misunderstanding occur. But nothing you have said about your ex sounds remotely like my experience. Do not feel guilty about this and do not allow yourself to feel responsible for him being abusive and manipulative. Please believe me when I say that everything you say about him sounds like a very familiar story of how to mistreat a romantic partner and is a laundry list of what not to do it a relationship.
You are well rid of him.
Absaroka

Absaroka

[JenniferMu.(GG)]

Tammy Lynn,

One thing I’ve never done and that is to even begin to think I could ever stop loving my parents. I don’t agree with what they’ve done and I’ve told them many times, and I don’t agree with them that’s it’s just their business, because on both accounts, our father dressing in women’s clothes and Mum choosing to divorce him, it’s effected the whole lot us, them and my sister and I, but I guess in the end the divorce was Mums decision. What irks me is that I’ve tried to pin her down many times on whether it was just Dad’s dressing up or if there is more to it than that, and knowing Mum as I do I think she’s telling me the truth when she says she just couldn’t go on living with a husband who preferred to dress up as a woman.

As for Dad, well I love him to bits and even if I never really come to terms with what he does I’ll never abandon him or stop loving him. I’ve got no idea of why he does it and he tells me he hasn’t either, so while I openly support him with it I secretly don’t like seeing him in women’s clothes but I’d never say that to him ever again.

And Stormy,

I meant to say to you a lot earlier that I just wish I had your courage. I was sort of dwarfed by him a bit and he’s so overbearing. He weighs in at around 90 kgs (about 190lb in your weights) and is 190 cms ( about 6ft 2in) I’m about 60kgs ( 135lb in your weights), 171cms ( about 5ft 7in) so it was no contest in physical strength, although apart from that one time he twisted my hair and pushed me in the chest a few times, he never really hit me or physically hurt me, but he sure scared me with his temper and smashing my things, but I hope and pray it’s all in the past now, he seems to be leaving me alone now, but the weekends is when he sort of drinks and stalks me mostly, anyway we’ll see in time I guess. All the names he calls me sort of pass over my head, although at times they do hurt a little because I’m not sure if that’s the real him saying those things or it’s just because I bring it out in him by denying what he seems so desperate to get from me, but if I have to be a bitch for him to leave me alone then so be it. I always think of lots to say to him after the event, but then I think if I back chatted him during his rage then maybe I’d get my head knocked off, so maybe better to keep my mouth shut, even though it’s so hard to do at times when he gives me a burst and calls me names which I feel I don’t deserve.

And Absoroka,

What you said backed up what he was saying. He used to keep on and on that if I really and truly loved him then I’d do the things with him he wanted. He used the love thing over and over until I used to get so confused in my own silly head of what was right or what was wrong. He’djust about convinced me it was my fault. It got so I felt selfish and a heel by denying him things and I used to think in quieter moments that maybe it was right to do those things with him if I really loved him, but it always got back to where I knew in my heart that, yes, I did love him, no other person had ever made me feel like he did, I couldn’t get him out of my mind day and night, but, on the other hand I fought my own personal battle with myself. I’d made a pact with myself that I would be like my Gran and my Mum and only do those things with the man I marry ( if that ever happens), so I always got back to telling myself that until I was ready to make a long term commitment with him then I wasn’t going to submit to him completely.

Now I absolutely have no idea of where you draw the line between right and wrong with kissing and cuddling. It’s a nice thing to do and I loved doing that with him, but he says I’m being a xxxx teaser by doing that and then stopping him from finishing the way he needs to. He always said it was different for men than women, men needed to let it out, where women could refrain from it easier. What I can’t understand is I can stop myself in the heat of the moment and maybe if he cared for me the way he says he does then can’t he do the same and wait until I’m ready, or does that amount to me just being the cold hearted so and so bitch he says I am.

Anyway, what you say about respect is what I said to him over and over. If he loves me truly then he must respect me…..right? or if he doesn’t respect me then he should look elsewhere for what he wants, right?
You see he and I seem to have different ideas about love and respect for each other. He says if I love and respect him then I’d want to make him happy and not frustrate him and make him angry. I say to him that if he loves and respects me then he’ll wait until I’m ready to believe we have something which makes me want to make a long term commitment, and I have no desire to become just another conquest like so many of my g/fs have in the last few years. I told him over and over that when I felt inside myself that I was ready to make a long term commitment then I would be his completely for ever, but he has this jealous thing where he thought I would meet someone else and he’d lose me, if I even spoke to another guy he’d get angry and then accuse me of wanting to do it with the other guy and not him, it nearly drove me crazy I tell you, but I tried to tell him if it’s right him and I are meant to be together then it’ll happen, if not then it would be better for us both to move on, as hard as they may be for us both., but I couldn’t see where there was a need to rush at my age, I really don’t know what I want yet, I need time more than anything after all that’s happened in my life the last 4 years.

As for the rape bit, well that never really became an issue, although there were times when I thought that we’d gone too far and he was going to force me, and if he wanted to then there’s nothing I could have done about it because he’s so much bigger and stronger than me, but although he used to lose his temper over it there was really only ever lots of shouting at me and verbal abuse. The one thing I never ever did was reduce myself to tears. I always remember what my Gran said to me when she said that we can’t stop them taking some things from us which they might want, but for me never to let a man take my dignity no matter what he did to me, and I think that riled him up some too, because the more I just looked back at him blank as he went on and on, the worse he got and it seemed in the end that he was trying to break me, but as scared as I was on the inside I’m made out of tougher stuff than he thought.

Anyway, thanks to you for passing on your knowledge to me and to everyone else I haven’t mentioned, it gives me strength when at times I feel what’s the use of everything. I think I’ll take the private advice of one of the women here and others here too and go seek some help from a group of women who advise people on how to deal with abuse. Hopefully it’s stopped, although in my heart, knowing him, I’m expecting him not to give up so easily, and I’m at the stage of not knowing how much I can take of his tirades as they get worse each time and I’m getting sick of jumping at shadows and looking behind me all the time, my nerves are about shattered atm.

I promise not to keep harrassing you all, I know you'll get sick of my goings on, anyway, thanks again for all the advice and help.

Jenny.

[DonnaT]

Jenny, your posts are no less important than anyone else's. Never forget that.

We are a community, whether you are trans, have a trans partner, trans sibling or trans parent, we are in the same community.

Now I absolutely have no idea of where you draw the line between right and wrong with kissing and cuddling. It’s a nice thing to do and I loved doing that with him, but he says I’m being a xxxx teaser by doing that and then stopping him from finishing the way he needs to. He always said it was different for men than women, men needed to let it out, where women could refrain from it easier. What I can’t understand is I can stop myself in the heat of the moment and maybe if he cared for me the way he says he does then can’t he do the same and wait until I’m ready, or does that amount to me just being the cold hearted so and so bitch he says I am.

Hopefully he'll be last BF you have that says that. At least you know now it's not true. You could possibly deny them the opportunity to try and repeatedly to get you to give in by taking away. Taking away is telling them the kissing and cuddling will cease until they can control their urges.

[Absaroka]

Jen you are not harrassing us. Keep right on posting.

When he says men can't stop once they get going, he is lying. Flat out lying. It's another one of those manipulative tricks men use, saying we just can't help ourselves. Don't fall for it.

It is possible to have sex with someone when they don't want you to. It is impossible to make love to someone when they don't want you to. It's a contradiction in terms. Maybe if we talk about love making here and not sex the discussion will become clearer.

I think your idea of finding some women to help you through this is a great one. Please do it soon.

I have to repeat myself some here. I have known a lot of fairly disturbed people, men and women, over the years. I can't tell you how sadly familiar your boyfriend sounds. All the same lies, manipulativeness, self pity, disrespect for others, and utter childishness. Please stop trying to take responsibility for his actions.

A c...teaser by the way is someone who does what they do for manipulative and selfish reasons, to hurt and control people, to get something from them that they thought they didn't want to give. They typically don't really care much about the man they are trying to lead around by his hormones. It doesn't sound like thats what you were doing.

He always had the option of telling you to stop and eventually most men do learn how to use that option. Most of us figure out how to masturbate before a date if we are worried about this sort of thing also although we don't talk about that with our date for obvious reasons.

We use womens names here and talk about getting in touch with our inner feminine and being transgendered and all that stuff. What I am going to say next may disturb a couple folks here but too bad.

Most of us at this forum are grown men who have had a lifetime of knowing ourselves and other men. For the most part we understand men pretty well I think, despite how we talk about our feminine side. And you have had a large number of men here telling you this guy is someone you are well rid of. I would go so far as to say he is acting totally unmanly. He's acting like a disturbed young boy. Or a selfish incipient alcoholic, which is also something you did not cause, can not control, and can not cure. I know you loved him and perhaps these things are still hard to hear. But please listen to us. If some creep ever treated my daughter like this I would like to think I would take legal action, because my other alternative would be highly illegal.

Absaroka